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Author Topic: Raw files in Elements 11  (Read 2912 times)

Offline loveclose

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Raw files in Elements 11
« on: October 18, 2012, 11:12:59 PM »
Hi gang - forgive the possible very basic question here....

I've been fiddling around with the trial version of Photoshop Elements 11.....

Had some success with jpegs, and have edited a couple of RAW images too.  When I came to save the edited Raw image, the file was defaulted to jpeg format.  The original raw file was 15.5meg - highest save now is 5.5 meg.

Am I losing anything severe in having the edited raw saved as a jpeg, or can I somehow keep the image as a raw file after editing??

Cheers m'deers.......


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Offline anglefire

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2012, 11:19:15 PM »
I don't use elements, but I assume that when you edit a raw file that it saves a file with all the edits within it to recreate what you have done next time you open the file.

As for the Jpeg file size, I wouldn't worry about the size - 5.5Mb is a large Jpeg - as long as you don't keep editing the Jpeg, it will be fine.

If you really want to keep large files, just change the output to TIFF or PSD - They will be suitably massive. But unless you are going to print massive pictures, then Jpegs will be perfectly fine!
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Offline SimonW

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2012, 09:16:59 AM »
Firstly, the RAW file is never changed, so you can go back to it and re-edit it anytime. Secondly, when you choose "save" you'll find a drop-down box with a choice of options so you can if you want select tiff or various other things instead of jpg. (It will always save a new file in addition to the original RAW file.) Thirdly, if you've left the setting on jpg, after clicking save you normally see a window giving you a slider you can move anywhere between low quality/small file and maximum quality/large file. I like to keep mine about 8 or 9.

(I've not used version 11, but my earlier Elements versions all work that way. Whatever, no photo editor ever changes a RAW file.)

Good luck with it. Simon
« Last Edit: October 19, 2012, 09:19:24 AM by SimonW »
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Offline Karen

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2012, 11:15:58 AM »
I shoot in raw so i have control over the image but save to the highest jpeg which lets face it is big enough for most peoples needs. You would take up masses of space keeping all as raw files :)

Offline donoreo

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2012, 02:17:20 PM »
I shoot in raw so i have control over the image but save to the highest jpeg which lets face it is big enough for most peoples needs. You would take up masses of space keeping all as raw files :)
I do the opposite and ONLY keep RAW files.  I can always export another jpg.  I consider RAW files to be the negatives jpgs to be prints.  I use Lightroom, so all of my editing is done on RAW files (or sometimes uncompressed TIFs). 

Offline Oldboy

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2012, 04:39:57 PM »
I shoot in raw so i have control over the image but save to the highest jpeg which lets face it is big enough for most peoples needs. You would take up masses of space keeping all as raw files :)

I shoot Raw plus fine Jpeg even with the Nikon D800.  :P

Offline loveclose

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2012, 03:25:18 PM »
Thanks to all for the comments - most helpful.

I had previously had a play around with Adobe CS5 which although is now significantly cheaper than the previous hights of sub £1000, is still pretty dear.  I'm purchasing Adobe Elements 11 for the time being as it has a fair amount of editing capacity thrown in which makes PS5 or now PS6 more easily forgettable - until the price is right at least.

Content-aware features (whcih I believe were available on Elements 10) are a big plus in Elements 11. ;)

Raw wise, space is not too big a problem for me atm - recently updated my PC with a 2TB hard disc which despite best efforts remains quite empty!!

I too now shoot Raw + Jpeg fine on my D200, a feature which is not quite equalled on my potential D7000 which offers Raw + Basic Jpeg if I'm not mistaken.....
« Last Edit: October 20, 2012, 03:27:58 PM by loveclose »
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Offline Oldboy

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2012, 07:55:17 PM »
According to Nikon's website it can save as a Raw plus any Jpeg format therefore, you can do Raw and Jpeg fine together.  :tup:

NEF (RAW): 12 or 14 bit, lossless compressed or compressed. JPEG: JPEG-Baseline compliant with fine (approx. 1:4), normal (approx. 1:8) or basic (approx. 1:16) compression (Size priority); Optimal quality compression available. NEF (RAW) + JPEG: Single photograph recorded in both NEF (RAW) and JPEG formats.

Offline loveclose

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2012, 07:57:58 PM »
According to Nikon's website it can save as a Raw plus any Jpeg format therefore, you can do Raw and Jpeg fine together.  :tup:

NEF (RAW): 12 or 14 bit, lossless compressed or compressed. JPEG: JPEG-Baseline compliant with fine (approx. 1:4), normal (approx. 1:8) or basic (approx. 1:16) compression (Size priority); Optimal quality compression available. NEF (RAW) + JPEG: Single photograph recorded in both NEF (RAW) and JPEG formats.

Another armtwister!! ;)  Thanks for the info!!
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Offline spinner

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2012, 11:04:49 AM »
I'll throw a little twist into this conversation. Did you have Camera Raw pop up when you opened the files? I will use Camera Raw to do first time processing/edits. If I don't intend to print or process further I just hit the 'done' button. It saves the edits in a separate file that is associates with the RAW in my case NEFs. Any time I reopen the file it comes up with my edits intact. If I hit default the file goes back to whatever came out of the camera so the edits aren't permanent. Camera Raw has a pretty good ranged of editing settings, though non of the 'artistic' ones.  ;)
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Offline loveclose

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2012, 11:16:50 AM »
I'll throw a little twist into this conversation. Did you have Camera Raw pop up when you opened the files? I will use Camera Raw to do first time processing/edits. If I don't intend to print or process further I just hit the 'done' button. It saves the edits in a separate file that is associates with the RAW in my case NEFs. Any time I reopen the file it comes up with my edits intact. If I hit default the file goes back to whatever came out of the camera so the edits aren't permanent. Camera Raw has a pretty good ranged of editing settings, though non of the 'artistic' ones.  ;)

Can't say I noticed  camera raw pop up.....

Will have another browse with a Nef file or two today... ;)

Any clues needed for what I'm lookin for, or will it be obvious?.....
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Offline donoreo

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2012, 02:53:38 PM »
I'll throw a little twist into this conversation. Did you have Camera Raw pop up when you opened the files? I will use Camera Raw to do first time processing/edits. If I don't intend to print or process further I just hit the 'done' button. It saves the edits in a separate file that is associates with the RAW in my case NEFs. Any time I reopen the file it comes up with my edits intact. If I hit default the file goes back to whatever came out of the camera so the edits aren't permanent. Camera Raw has a pretty good ranged of editing settings, though non of the 'artistic' ones.  ;)

Can't say I noticed  camera raw pop up.....

Will have another browse with a Nef file or two today... ;)

Any clues needed for what I'm lookin for, or will it be obvious?.....
You would notice, ACR has a  light grey interface so it is very obvious. 

Offline loveclose

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2012, 03:09:40 PM »
Mrs Loveclose bought me Elements 11 for my birthday (today ;)) and am about to 'legalise' my trial version with the serial number on my hard copy.  Will have another look then at Raw bizz.  Thanks for your info on this. :tup:
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Offline loveclose

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2012, 04:19:12 PM »
Right - got it.

Did see that window before, but didn't realise it was the 'camera raw' window.

Now I've opened a Raw file - and I've tweaked it within Camera Raw - exposure and light mainly.

Now at this stage, I'm thinking the following:

1)  Camera Raw saves the tweaked settings only - not a new Raw image.  It's the edited slider postitions that get 'remembered' for that shot when reopened within Camera Raw.
2)  Clicking 'Done' saves the Camera Raw editor's settings
3)  Clicking 'open file' at the bottom of the Camera Raw window opens the editied raw image into the main Elements programme where more work can be done - but then that file can be saved as a jpeg or tiff, but not Raw.
4)  I checked the Camera Raw settings on a different Raw image - all were set at the default mid point.  Reopening the previous Raw image put all the sliders back to the 'saved' position for that photograph.  It's like opening a preset for that photo without losing the original photo.

If any of the above are incorrect assumptions, please correct!!  Again, appreciate the info on this as the editing done within Camera Raw has definitely enhanced a photo very well, remembered the editing settings without saving a fresh copy. :tup: :beer:
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Offline Hinfrance

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Re: Raw files in Elements 11
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2012, 05:46:34 PM »
ACR like most RAW editors creates a 'sidecar' file that contains information about the edits done to the original file, which remains untouched.  If you have colour sensitive information to edit in Elements it is best to do as much in ACR as possible as the ACR engine is 16 bit, Elements editor is only 8 bit.

I tend to edit the basics in Lightroom or Aftershot Pro. If more serious fettling is likely I use Serif Photoplus which is a full 16 bit editor (much improved X6 version for 64 bit OS due out soon ;)).

That said, 95% of the time Elements (with a decent curves plugin, like Easy Filter - why does Elements still not have a proper curves tool?) is more than adequate.
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