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Author Topic: What a peculiar situation.  (Read 2018 times)

Offline ABERS

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What a peculiar situation.
« on: April 22, 2011, 07:26:02 AM »
I didn't know whether to post this in 'Joke of the Day' or not but decided it was too bizarre.

We had a meal with some close friends yesterday and during the course of conversation the forthcoming referendum on the voting system came up. One of the party is a German national married to an Englishman and has lived and worked in the UK for some 30+ years. She decided to keep her German nationality and by doing so has, quite rightly in her eyes, no vote in the UK at general elections. Fully aware of this she rarely comments on the state of play politically here, although has paid taxes since she moved here.

However she now discovers that she has a vote in the forthcoming referendum, so she can have an input into the way we vote in future, but no vote in whatever system is chosen! :o

P.S. She has no intention of expressing her views in the referendum.



Offline Colin

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2011, 07:38:54 AM »
This seems to be an EU thing (possibly). I live in Spain and am on the voters register (required by law here if you live here permanently) BUT I can't vote in General elections only Local Elections. It looks like it might be the same but it does seem odd, I pay local and national taxes but can only influence the local bureaucrats.

Offline Malcolm1938

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2011, 08:43:45 AM »
This seems to be an EU thing (possibly). I live in Spain and am on the voters register (required by law here if you live here permanently) BUT I can't vote in General elections only Local Elections. It looks like it might be the same but it does seem odd, I pay local and national taxes but can only influence the local bureaucrats.

Do you really think the the local bureaucrats or any bureaucrats are really capable of being influenced. To me they seem to be unable to think away from the party line and even the independent are rarely willing to stick their necks out because they are on the gravy train and the next election is coming.

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Offline Hinfrance

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2011, 10:05:07 AM »
We pay our taxes and have the right to vote in the mayoral, council, and EU elections but are disenfranchised from voting in French national elections and any minute now we will also lose our right to vote in UK elections even though we remain UK citizens.

Makes you feel somehow Bostonian.

Where did they park those tea ships?

Malcolm's point seems along the lines of one of my thoughts: it doesn't matter who you vote for, a politician always wins . . .
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Offline Colin

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2011, 07:30:30 AM »
It helps when one of the councillors is a neighbour, you get more done if you let him know you are thinking of not voting for his party (PR here). I wouldn't vote for any of the others though as they aren't neighbours ;) but I don't tell him that.

Offline Hinfrance

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2011, 07:46:41 AM »
It helps when one of the councillors is a neighbour, you get more done if you let him know you are thinking of not voting for his party (PR here). I wouldn't vote for any of the others though as they aren't neighbours ;) but I don't tell him that.

Our mayor is the mum of one of our good friends :)
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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2011, 08:19:58 AM »
All seems a touch of modern bureaucracy to me, which is why i shall vote yes to AV.

I fancy a change from a system which allows the sort of government control we've had over the last few decades...

Offline Oldboy

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2011, 09:20:34 AM »
All seems a touch of modern bureaucracy to me, which is why i shall vote yes to AV.

I fancy a change from a system which allows the sort of government control we've had over the last few decades...

The interesting fact that hasn't been raised is that your votes will count. The present system is flawed, because if you vote for a party that will come third, it's a wasted vote so why vote. Now your choices might stop someone who you don't want to win.  ;D

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2011, 10:45:11 PM »

any minute now we will also lose our right to vote in UK elections even though we remain UK citizens.

Good.

No really, you choose to live in a different country, then why should you have the right to choose the government of the day, when you don't live here?

When/if you come back then you can vote again.

Slightly different, if you are working away for a short period or in the forces.
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Offline spinner

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2011, 12:25:36 AM »
Here, in my little portion of the colonies, if you own property, you pay property taxes. If you pay property taxes you have the right to vote in the municipal election where you reside regardless of citizenship. Political parties are barred from involvement in Municipal politics.

Back when I got my Canadian Citizen ship we were still considered British subjects, I don't know if that means I revoked my U.K. citizenship. Or if Trudeau revoked my citizenship for me when he repatriated the Constitution in '82.
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Offline ABERS

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2011, 07:35:46 AM »
Being somewhat decisive by nature, I've made up my mind.
Maybe will be my first choice.
Not on your Nellie my second.
Without a doubt my third.
Yes and No my fourth.
 :legit:
« Last Edit: April 24, 2011, 07:37:27 AM by ABERS »

Offline Hinfrance

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2011, 08:37:05 AM »

any minute now we will also lose our right to vote in UK elections even though we remain UK citizens.

Good.

No really, you choose to live in a different country, then why should you have the right to choose the government of the day, when you don't live here?

When/if you come back then you can vote again.

Slightly different, if you are working away for a short period or in the forces.

It's simple - in Europe suffrage is based upon citizenship - maybe it's not perfect. We still pay UK taxes on our investments, our income is from our UK pension, and we are still citizens. So what the government in the UK does or does not do affects us directly. No taxation without representation  :tup: Australian citizens, for example, have the legal obligation to vote, no matter where they live. As it goes we do not vote in UK elections, because even if the proposed reforms go through there still won't be a 'none of the above' option. :2funny:

When we moved to France it took 3 years to persuade the HMRC to stop taxing our pension income, but they stopped our child allowance in less than a week . .  :legit:
« Last Edit: April 24, 2011, 10:11:05 AM by Hinfrance »
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Offline Simple

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2011, 10:02:34 AM »
I am from the Netherlands. Came here in 1986 and have worked here nearly all that time. (retired, with British company Pension for the last 5 years and worked away in Oman for just over a year) I still have my Dutch Passport, because that is where I was born and I still feel like a Dutchman. (albeit with a very British taste) I have never been able to vote for general elections, can vote for local elections, are not allowed to vote for Dutch general/local elections.
It has some advantages of course.
1. I can complain about any government because I have not voted for it. I have noticed a lot of people in Britain (and Holland) complain about the government even if they voted for it.
2. I can avoid any and all political discussion by claiming I am not interested, because I can't vote. This is good, because political discussions nearly always end up in arguments.
3. I can openly voice my opinion on the amount of foreigners in this country because I am one myself!
4. If England plays Holland I never loose!!!
I wish I could become an illegal foreigner, that would make me a rich man.

Offline Hinfrance

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2011, 10:10:07 AM »

1. I can complain about any government because I have not voted for it. I have noticed a lot of people in Britain (and Holland) complain about the government even if they voted for it.
2. I can avoid any and all political discussion by claiming I am not interested, because I can't vote. This is good, because political discussions nearly always end up in arguments.
3. I can openly voice my opinion on the amount of foreigners in this country because I am one myself!
4. If England plays Holland I never loose!!!

 

 :tup: :tup: :tup: , only substitute France for Holland in the last one  :)
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Offline Oldboy

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Re: What a peculiar situation.
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2011, 06:48:43 PM »
Here, in my little portion of the colonies, if you own property, you pay property taxes. If you pay property taxes you have the right to vote in the municipal election where you reside regardless of citizenship. Political parties are barred from involvement in Municipal politics.

Back when I got my Canadian Citizen ship we were still considered British subjects, I don't know if that means I revoked my U.K. citizenship. Or if Trudeau revoked my citizenship for me when he repatriated the Constitution in '82.

You can still have duel citizenship so, because you have become a canadian citizen doesn't revoke your UK status. There are a few exceptions like the USA where, you have to revoke your previous citizenship to become a US one.  ;D

 

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