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Author Topic: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,  (Read 6781 times)

Offline Bigbill

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Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« on: May 21, 2010, 07:47:10 PM »
Hewwo from Balmy Sheffy,
Now then,,,,,the following is a look at my recent photo activites,,,,Few weeks ago a 3 day boxing tournament,great experience,technicly its a right bloody(geddit) test,lighting is always crap and the action very fast,anyway,enough of the Pugilists bought pics of themselves being battered to make it worth my while.Strangely,the boxers themselves were not what i expected,quite reserved and shy,,,,,until they entered the ring !Boxing doesnt have any of the "up itself" mentality of some sports and it was a pleasure to cover it.One thing i picked up here,,i deffo require a full frame high ISO performing unit,,,,,
Last week i was lucky enough to cover a show by the Australian Pink Floyd,,,,,,something i,ll NEVER  forget,,there i was,chin resting on the stage watching these master musicians at work,,,,,AWESOME,thing with this was the extreme changes in lighting from one second to the next,,,actualy more challenging than the Boxing,,,,,maybe i can get them to perform under a boxing light rig next time ????
The scale of this show was massive compared to anything i,d done before,the 3 songs i was allowed went by far too quickly,,,,everyone at the venue went the extra mile to help me,,as usual with such things the promoters hadnt notified the venue i was coming and the obligatory messing about at the box office followed,,,,,,then the head of security stuck his oar in,,,,,,then the pit manager had to do his bit,,,,,if you ever intend to do concert work be prepared for this sort of carry on,,it happens EVERY time !But,once it was sorted everything went great,,,,up to now my pics have sold in USA,Canada,Poland,France,all over the UK and ive more than bettered what i expected to do.
This week its an American Football game,be nice not to have to worry about lighting and stuff,,,,,,plus the current bun will be out,,,,,anyone wandering about photography becoming more than a hobby,,,,DO IT but expect lots of foot slog and toil,,,,,event staff really do think that the togs are there to be "bossed" but once you get through to them its a very satisfying feeling to see people who are willing to pay for your stuff !!

Shine On

www.gigstills.co.uk
« Last Edit: May 21, 2010, 07:49:59 PM by Bigbill »



picsfor

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2010, 07:57:28 PM »
Glad to see things are working for you Bill.
Well, they will be once you have yourself a nice D700 or 2. Nice full frame high iso capable camera indeed...
If in doubt - speak to those who have them. I haven't heard a bad word abut them yet!

A simple thought - are you allowed to use flash when photographing the musical events?

Offline Bigbill

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2010, 08:36:20 PM »
Heyyaz Piccy Baby,,,,,,

Flash,,,depends really,,,,at the APF show it was a deffo no no,,,,,they warned me that if i used flash i would have to sit through the Rihanna gig the next night,,,,,NO WAY !!!!
Other shows ive asked and they havent batted an eye lid,,,,,,funny story,,at the boxing ,on the 1st day i used flash all day and no one was bothered,,,,2nd day an ABA official objected,,i asked him why he never objected the day before and he said "i didnt notice you using it" !!!!!!! how STUPID an answer is that ???
Ok,,,may i pick the collective Borg type mind here,,,,,,bear in mind i use only Nikon stuff,,,,,which(strictly based on ISO performance) is the best unit to purchase ????

Shine On

www.gigstills.co.uk

Offline Oldboy

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2010, 09:00:24 PM »
Hi Bill. Glad loads of money is coming your way.  :tup:

The highest ISO camera is the Nikon D3s at 102,400 but will set you back about £3,500 or you could go for secondhand D3 at about £2,300. A new D700 would set you back about £1,779 or a secondhand one about £1,400. On a D3 the ISO can be increased upto 25,600 but it will show noise so I limit mine to 6,400. Hope that helps.  ;D

Offline ABERS

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2010, 10:16:28 PM »
Great to hear everything's on the up Bill and more importantly you're enjoying it and making a living.

Cheers....Alan :tup:

Offline Eileen

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2010, 11:07:49 PM »
Glad to hear things are going well for you Bill.  :tup:

picsfor

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2010, 06:40:37 AM »
Heyyaz Piccy Baby,,,,,,
bear in mind i use only Nikon stuff,,,,,which(strictly based on ISO performance) is the best unit to purchase ????

I'm a Canon man but looked at moving to Nikon because of the iso issue at one point and your options really are the D700 and D3.
From your point of view it depends on budget...

Without a doubt your D3's are the most robust body and certainly are weatherproofed to the nth level - but then you can get 2 D700's for the price of 1 D3(s).
Image quality every bit as good at high iso (6400) and under the right conditions can stretch to 12800 and even 25600.

With the D700 you can add a battery grip to up the frame rate (as well as extend the battery life during the shoot) - if you need the extra fps.

Offline Jonathan

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2010, 08:20:31 AM »
Without a doubt your D3's are the most robust body and certainly are weatherproofed to the nth level

You see everybody says that......in my entire life I've only had issues with kit and rain on 3 occasions.  2 of those were when the inside of my D3 fogged to the extent that I couldn't see what I was shooting.  Both times it had been subjected to heavy rain but so had the D2 on my other shoulder.  The other was when my 24-70 fogged inside (i.e. through the weather seals) and was useless for an hour or more.

So either
1. I've been unlucky
2. I'm harder on my kit than I used to be (certainly true - it's amazing the D3 keeps going...)
3. The weather seals ain't as good as they used to be.

Anyway, there's a very easy answer to your question.  On ISO alone the best Nikon ever made is the D3S.  At least a stop and possibly 2 better than the D3/D700 (they have identical sensors) which are at least a stop better than anything else.

So.....one boxing match and a gig give enough profit to fund a new D3S?  I'm in the wrong game..... :)
It's Guest's round

picsfor

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2010, 08:43:37 AM »
So either
1. I've been unlucky
2. I'm harder on my kit than I used to be (certainly true - it's amazing the D3 keeps going...)
3. The weather seals ain't as good as they used to be.

I'd go with 2 - purely because as you become familiar with your work tools you tend to 'push them' more than you would when they a fresh out of the box.

As for the justification issue - that's why i suggested 2 x D700 to 1 x D3s.
I assume that as a pro you need 2 bodies - and the cost of a second D700 could be funded as much be the disposal of Bills current 2 bodies.
Like you i do not think the boxing match and APF concert bring in sufficient revenue to justify the D3s - but over the longer course i suspect that the business case could justify the trade up to 2 x D700's.
And they are not to be sneezed at.

Now for Bill to comment  :tup:

Offline Eileen

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2010, 09:41:44 AM »
At the risk of stating the obvious you also have to factor in the cost of a new lens (or two) if you move to full frame Bill. There isn't nearly as much choice as there is for smaller sensors, and the really good lenses are dear. By really good in your context I mean fast zooms with good autofocus motors. In the sort of conditions you're working in decent lenses will help greatly increase your hit rate. you can correct a slightly imperfect picture in post-processing in many ways but if it's out of focus then it's lost.

There's a lot of talk that Nikon will bring out a consumer version of the D3s at Photokina in the autumn, and they have started to bring out slightly cheaper FX lenses. If you hung on until then you might have more choice (and the D700 should fall in price when a newer model comes out). Good luck, whatever you decide! :)

Offline Bigbill

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2010, 05:27:05 PM »
Hewwo from hotter than Rome Sheffy !!!

Now then,,,,not sure where this assumption that i,m raking it in has come from,i just posted my stuff to let people know what sort of stuff goes on even when youve ticked all the boxes at events !
As it is,ive not grossed the total cost of all my gear yet,though i am now heading in the right direction.Some of you may recall ive often berated the music scene around here,and my view has not changed,i get emails eveyweek to go and snap unsigned bands,,,you can probably guess the bit nobody mentions,,,,,and,,you can also probably guess the bit which i wont print here !!!But,without the help of the £3-40 a pint venue owners i,m getting there anyway,which is the real lesson here(i think).
D3s,,,gotta admit,i,d LOVE one and it may well happen soon,,,,,would make life much easier for me,my personal preference has always been  to work in low light,,,God knows why !! And as such the gear i,m using just dont cut it by comparison,,,,,but thats life innit,,you work with what you have got,and dont waste time on what you havent got.
All this weather seal talk baffles me a bit,,,,they never mention weather seals on lenses do they ??Look at all the top class work JR does in all sorts of weather and he,s had hardly any problems,,,,and when your lugging gear about all over the place it takes a right battering.At the Boxing one of the refs accidently kicked my D80 about 10 feet along the floor,,,,he was proper worried,,no problem though,,its fine.
Now then,,heres a good one for everybody,,why the hell does my D300 perform so poorly in low light,,its SUPPOSED to be quite bloody good ??? heres where you all begin to doubt my sanity(if you dont already),,i,m sure theres something specific about D300 hundred noise which Noise Ninja cant hack,....... i cannot for the life of me understand why the D80 shots look better then the D300.....or is my mental illness again ????????

Shine On

picsfor

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2010, 05:57:05 PM »
D80 better in low light than a D300?

Take D300 back to shop and ask for a replacement!

MY mate swapped his D80 for a D300s because of low light performance of said D80 and is markedly impressed by the improved low light performance.
The s only has video over the non s version i believe so something is clearly wrong with your camera!

Offline Oldboy

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2010, 06:50:49 PM »
Without a doubt your D3's are the most robust body and certainly are weatherproofed to the nth level

You see everybody says that......in my entire life I've only had issues with kit and rain on 3 occasions.  2 of those were when the inside of my D3 fogged to the extent that I couldn't see what I was shooting.  Both times it had been subjected to heavy rain but so had the D2 on my other shoulder.  The other was when my 24-70 fogged inside (i.e. through the weather seals) and was useless for an hour or more.

So either
1. I've been unlucky
2. I'm harder on my kit than I used to be (certainly true - it's amazing the D3 keeps going...)
3. The weather seals ain't as good as they used to be.

Anyway, there's a very easy answer to your question.  On ISO alone the best Nikon ever made is the D3S.  At least a stop and possibly 2 better than the D3/D700 (they have identical sensors) which are at least a stop better than anything else.

So.....one boxing match and a gig give enough profit to fund a new D3S?  I'm in the wrong game..... :)

No you haven't been unlucky JR. My D3 fogged up as well but the D200 never did and I've posted the proof below.  ???



Click for bigger size.

I must add the D3 worked fine after a evening on the radiator to dry it out.  :tup:
« Last Edit: May 22, 2010, 06:54:18 PM by Oldboy »

Offline Eileen

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #13 on: May 22, 2010, 06:54:00 PM »
The D300 was a good two stops better than earlier Nikon enthusiast cameras for noise control: although the 300s uses the same sensor I've heard that the internal processor has improved and noise is better controlled again. In any event, as Andrew has said, if you're finding your 300 worse than the 80 then something's wrong.

It might be a problem with the camera but I wondered if maybe the difference you see is affected by exposure or other settings in any way? Noise is always more visible in shadow areas, and if, for example, the D300 was more inclined to underexposure in some situations and the D80 to overexpose then that might lead to the shots from the D300 looking more noisy. Speaking from my own experience my D300 is much, much better than my previous camera (D70s) at any ISO above 200. Maybe worth some test shots with the cameras Bill, to see if you can work out what's happening?

Offline Bigbill

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Re: Struggles,Doubts and things,,,,
« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2010, 07:09:02 PM »
Heyyaz Eileen and thanks to all for the replies,,,,

Yahh twill be my error somewhere,,,,,,the actual noise from the 300 seems so different than the 80,,i,ll keep plodding away at it,i actuay now quite appreciate Noise Ninja,,,,its very good at what it does,,,,
i just keep struggling with the shots from the 300,,i,ll get there eventualy.
American Football for me tomorrow,,,,,nice bright sunny day,,,,all that light !! Yeahhhhhhh
So,,who in CC is harbouring plans to try and earn form their hobby ??

Shine On

 

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