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Author Topic: 18?? What??  (Read 2079 times)


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18?? What??
« on: February 18, 2010, 11:00:20 PM »
Canon are to release a "serious amateur" camera, the EOS 550D, with a shoe-horning 18MP rating.


Ok, I've been out of "the loop" for while, regarding photography etc, but c'mon... 18!?

I did have a rant lined-up, a while ago, about another of Canons carrots. I think it was the 5 sumat or other. I know it was about MP ratings though... I think.

... or was it DCMs "Bumper book of photography tips: Issue 5, outdoor photography" (hopefully it had hints on tripod erection (I tried to avoid that one... I really did!)). Memory fails me, as does my 'trusty' N95.

Where was I? Ah, aye... 550D.

So... when, oh when, are camera manufacturers actually going to do something different with their newest offerings, and *not* cram in more pixels? My 350D works perfectly fine, and has a measly 8MP... less than half of Canons newest creations, and no less capable. And that's before I even venture on to the point-n-squirt night/macro/sports/etc modes!

Why were such 'modes' ever dubbed "creativity"?? Is it any wonder why I hanker after an Epson RD-1s? Maybe I should just whack a roll of Fuji into my IIIc. At least that's full-frame, and has none of that portrait/landscape/no-flash "creativity" mode cack.

Hang on... er...

... wait a minute... where am I??
Er... I seem to have lost my way. This post seems to have appeared here, as opposed to my dwindling weblog. Whoops. :)

Offline Jonathan

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2010, 08:32:41 AM »
It's always puzzled me why manufacturers adding stuff to cameras angers people so much.

Extra pixels?  OK.  I guess I'll just get a bigger hard drive for half the cost of a smaller one 2 weeks ago.

Video mode?  I don't need to turn it on.


Was talking to a guy yesterday who uses a Sinar.  He says it's OK - but it's slightly annoying when he goes to take a shot and it decides it's time for a calibration frame.  40 seconds to transfer a black frame to Capture 1.  A bargain for £25K.
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Offline Graham

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2010, 05:20:07 PM »
 I think generally you can blame "Market Research". You can usually tell the companies that employ focus groups etc.
 There's no point asking Joe Public what he wants next because Joe Public dos'nt know what he can have.
 If you'd asked my Grandad what he would like to improve his domestic life he would probably have asked for something to stop the rollers on his mangle sticking together when he's not used it for a couple of days!
 He would almost certainly not have asked for a front opening white box to put in the scullery which illuminates the contents when opened and keeps his cans of lager nice and cold. (And not only because he'd never heard of cans of lager!)
 I believe Mac (You know. The computer people.) don't do any kind of market research, and if thats the case then they will be the ones  I go to when this thing finally runs out of elastic (Or whatever powers it.).
                                 As Ever.  Graham.
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Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. 

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Offline Malcolm1938

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2010, 07:40:54 PM »
Manufacturers will alway seek to improve a current model as it is usually the cheapest way to advance their product range. Market research does not come into it when working with an existing product because completely new ideas tend to be more expensive to implement.

My way of thinking is alien to manufacturers for the same reason (cost) . I use a 10mpx camera and would rather have a new camera with the same number of pixels on a bigger sensor than a greater number of pixels on the same size sensor. The only way I would jump from 10mpx to 18mpx would be following a lottery win allowing me to move to full frame or bigger.

Future developments may change my thinking one day but just now I say 18mpx APS C - Why, Why, Why......

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Offline oRGie

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2010, 07:54:39 PM »
Maybe its marketing hype, maybe not, but the increase in mp isnt the only advancement in sensors, although higher iso isnt needed a lot of the time, its really a byproduct of the advancing sensor technology and the manufacturing tech being used to make them.

Nothing wrong with having the option to crop a shot and still have a usable size pic to play with either.

One thing for sure, you cant say the picture quality is worse on an 18mp camera than on an 8mp camera, so whats the problem, no-ones being forced to upgrade ;)  and buyers of the latest 550D are just benefiting from the latest tech in the higher end cameras, win win for the consumers.

Offline hevans

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2010, 10:21:00 PM »

To be honest, I've got more than I can deal with (wife, kids, mortgage, D300), and don't really care about extra mega-pixels. I'd rather have more time and more skill.

But the camera companies have to sell cameras, and this is easily achieved by demonstrating that the current crop is obsolete, nurturing the disposable society and get people to "trade up". For the average punter, Mpixels is an "obvious" improvement. To argue with them that it doesn't really help or is unnecessary is a waste of breath.

Just enjoy what you have and find comfort in the fact that your current setup is more than adequate for your skill levels. (that said, I've seen a 24Mp Leaf in action...wow...but then it was medium format...and the photographer was quite quite skilled).


Offline alan1j

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2010, 12:57:27 PM »
Funny really that it seams the more pixels you can cram into a sensor and more gadgets a camera can do the more the manufactures think you will want them...?? When I was upgrading from a sonyA100 and was after buying a Sony A700 knowing that the model was being discontinued every camere shop I went into said the same..
Buy an A500/550. Really I said and why is that...OH it has live view, or more pixels. My reply was quite short, DOES IT MAKE TEA TOO..??!!
I got some strange looks and comments in return. But all I wanted was a normal camera of good quality that behaved like a real camera when being used.
ONE guy even tried his hardest to sell me a Nikon D90. Yes a very good camera I told him but will it take Sony/Minolta lens.!!!!???

SO between manufactures and retailers their will always be the candy on the shelf. The question is are we really going to improve our skills with the latest camera. Even with a trillion pixels( One Day), it's still the tog behind the camera that has the last say on his/her quest for improvement.

There are many great photographers on this site whom still use older models and produce stunning shots without the need to upgrade.

Me I just want to improve with the equipment I now have, Although a couple of lenses are on my wish list..
And that's only because they would make my kit more versatile.
Maybe one day a full frame body, but in the mean time I'm still struggling along to get the hang of these 10/12m pixel bodies I have now.. :D :2funny:

Offline Jonathan

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2010, 01:33:55 PM »
One thing for sure, you cant say the picture quality is worse on an 18mp camera than on an 8mp camera

Um, it's possible you can.  Check out the pixel counts of the Canon G9, G10 and G11.  People who complained about IQ on the G10 were all smug when Canon dropped the number of pixels on the G11.

ETA: Oh and the D2X actually has more pixels than the D3.  But only by a bit.
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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2010, 08:53:02 PM »
The problem is understanding how much of the R&D that brings about the advances being dicussed is done for the benefit of consumers, and how much is done for scientific or military purposes...

The fact that we are able to have this discussion is down to the fact that the Pentagon wanted to find a way to cut its cost in R&D by linking all the research establishments in a way that would allow the instant sharing of information -it developed a system called ARPENET. A purely military thing...

Yet, following advances in the science created by ARPENET we now have the Internet which allows us to exchange thoughts, ideas and information in a way that could not even be concieved in 1970 let alone 1980.

So, with that in mind - how did we come by digital sensors? Who did actually fund that research?
Higher ISO allows better imaging in low or no light - a toy just for the consumer?
Pictures that capture so much data that a picture can be resolved to show amazing detail that we could only dream of - i'll bet your Jessops customers were screaming for that!
HD Video? A still can do a wonderful job but a video clip can sometimes do a better job of telling the story - certainly in court
Tamper proof Images - look at the encryption that can be built into an image nowadays... The evidence has not been doctored your honour!

Yep - we are not even close to knowing what the military are playing with - but give it 10 years and we will - in the Sony A 2000, Canon 1DsMkVIII, Nikon D6 etc. Enjoy the benefits because your taxes are paying for them  :tup:

Oh yes, and they're keeping various people in a job  :tup:

Offline Moses

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2010, 10:59:52 PM »
The way I look at these new mega-mega pixel camera's is that it makes wildlife photography easier for people who do not have good fieldcraft skills.
Why spend years learning field craft to get close to your subject when you can go out and buy a big lens and a mega pixel body quite cheaply these days, take a shot at distance and then crop it heavily.
It does put what was once an art into the anyone can do it bracket........, but is this good for the wildlife as well as the photographer?

Offline Zenmer

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Re: 18?? What??
« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2010, 06:33:58 AM »
Let's put a simple take on it !!!

Whenever I get a new camera the first thing I am asked is "How many megapixels", same with camera phones, people brag how many megapixels their new phone is without having a clue as to what they are talking about

The general public have been brainwashed into thinking more is better, ask one of them what lens they are using and the normal answer is something cheap and cheerful, but of course my pictures are bound to be better because my camera is a higher res
Two things are infinite : the universe and human stupidity; I’m not sure about the universe


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