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Author Topic: National Geographic "winning" competition image bites the dust! A bit harsh  (Read 1574 times)

Offline jinky

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http://www.digitalcameraworld.com/2013/01/11/first-place-not-in-the-bag-national-geographic-photo-contest-winner-disqualified/

Poor guy - disqualified for cloning a paper bag - come on! What do you think? Must have been annoying - must be thinking why didn`t I move that!!!!
« Last Edit: January 12, 2013, 10:32:25 AM by jinky »



Offline Graham

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Re: Another "winning" competition image bites the dust! A bit harsh
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2013, 10:35:43 AM »
  Harsh,  but "didn't read the rules".
  If I'm takeing a landscape and I see a crisp bag in the foreground, I'm quite happy to walk up and remove it. What if I don't notice it at the time and see it on the computer screen? Am I "allowed" remove it with the clone tool? What if the offending bag was up a tree and out of reach?
  Questions...always so many questions!  :-\
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Offline Beaux Reflets

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I think it is one of those awkward points of view;

 If a photographer takes the time to remove any offending object within the framed view, the momentry aspect might well be lost; providing a staged or stiff looking image of a scene!

Quite frankly I think while rules are rules; perhaps the rules should allow the cloning out of something that may have blown into the frame.  :tup:
Sure we can all become a little lazy on location as the clone tool is so easy to master, and rules that work against bad habits are generally for the good when photographing 'set pieces'.

The real question for me here is, If the brightness of the bag had been reduced with a little 'burn' to become almost lost within the rocky scenery, and with a similar tonal enhancement toward the emphasis of the light as had been processed, would the judges have still selected that shot as a winner!? If the answer is yes, then perhaps it is a very harsh afterthought of decision.

The almost constant array of photographic competitions disqualifying images in an after thought process tells me something. They are either wanting cheap publicity for themselves, after all controversy press is usually free!, or they have not fully digested the new age of being digital and rewritten rules that encourage more energetic photography that catches the moment in 'writing with light'.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2013, 12:41:05 PM by Beaux Reflets »
:beer: Andy

"Light anchors things in place and gives perspective meaning."

The choices we make are rooted in reflection.

http://beauxreflets.blogspot.com/

Offline Graham

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I think it is one of those awkward points of view;

 If a photographer takes the time to remove any offending object within the framed view, the momentry aspect might well be lost; providing a staged or stiff looking image of a scene!

Quite frankly I think while rules are rules; perhaps the rules should allow the cloning out of something that may have blown into the frame.  :tup:
Sure we can all become a little lazy on location as the clone tool is so easy to master, and rules that work against bad habits are generally for the good when photographing 'set pieces'.

The real question for me here is, If the brightness of the bag had been reduced with a little 'burn' to become almost lost within the rocky scenery, and with a similar tonal enhancement toward the emphasis of the light as had been processed, would the judges have still selected that shot as a winner!? If the answer is yes, then perhaps it is a very harsh afterthought of decision.

The almost constant array of photographic competitions disqualifying images in an after thought process tells me something. They are either wanting cheap publicity for themselves, after all controversy press is usually free!, or they have not fully digested the new age of being digital and rewritten rules that encourage more energetic photography that catches the moment in 'writing with light'.

  I think your last paragraph could be nearer the truth than any of us would like.
Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day.
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. 

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Offline donoreo

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I do not think it is harsh at all.  The rules were available before he entered and he did not read them.  I say that is his fault.   

Offline Beaux Reflets

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I do not think it is harsh at all.  The rules were available before he entered and he did not read them.  I say that is his fault.   

When a cropped photograph can be acceptable (where lots of digital information is removed) it sort of makes a mockery if a few pixels are replaced by the clone tool in the age of digital photography. Clever burning would do the same after all !!   :tup:
 
 But as you say rules are rules -   :D
:beer: Andy

"Light anchors things in place and gives perspective meaning."

The choices we make are rooted in reflection.

http://beauxreflets.blogspot.com/

Offline donoreo

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I do not think it is harsh at all.  The rules were available before he entered and he did not read them.  I say that is his fault.   

When a cropped photograph can be acceptable (where lots of digital information is removed) it sort of makes a mockery if a few pixels are replaced by the clone tool in the age of digital photography. Clever burning would do the same after all !!   :tup:
 
 But as you say rules are rules -   :D
Burning was allowed and so was cropping.   It is worth it to read the rules for any contest. 

Offline Beaux Reflets

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I do not think it is harsh at all.  The rules were available before he entered and he did not read them.  I say that is his fault.   

When a cropped photograph can be acceptable (where lots of digital information is removed) it sort of makes a mockery if a few pixels are replaced by the clone tool in the age of digital photography. Clever burning would do the same after all !!   :tup:
 
 But as you say rules are rules -   :D
Burning was allowed and so was cropping.   It is worth it to read the rules for any contest.

Totally agree about reading rules  :)

I maybe unusual in my approach to editing ? but probably not  :tup:.

When looking at a photograph (before any editing whatsoever) I tend to study the whole and then consider the compositional aspects as I process the image. The reaction to something I thought may suit when viewing through the viewfinder is often different to that when the image is viewed larger on screen. Something that jumps out to draw the eye away from the composition, feeling I'm after; in a brightly lit shot will likely be cloned away - its quick and efficient.  :tup:  In low light shots burning or some dissolving may be done with an additional mask area, but only where the intrigue aspect warrants the editing time.

Quite frankly, more respect should be given to the photographer by the folk who run photo competitions! If the photographer has masked out an area in any form to the benefit of the shots composition; good on his or her professional ability  :tup: That is what it is all about!

And in general, professional photographers make their decision and edit each shot in the most efficient manner.

So in short and in my opinion, the judges have shown a clear lack in the understanding of 'the Natural editing processes' when working with digital photography and accordingly devalued their own collective ability in judging to a joke.

Or as intimated (by way of my earlier opinion) followed written rules set to trip some contenders, for the chance it may bring a few free articles putting the competition in lights without the advertising spend.

Are there any photography competitions that provide real decent and worthy merit ? Apart from those held here  ;)
« Last Edit: January 12, 2013, 09:49:00 PM by Beaux Reflets »
:beer: Andy

"Light anchors things in place and gives perspective meaning."

The choices we make are rooted in reflection.

http://beauxreflets.blogspot.com/

Offline Oldboy

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Totally agree about reading rules  :)

I maybe unusual in my approach to editing ? but probably not  :tup:.

When looking at a photograph (before any editing whatsoever) I tend to study the whole and then consider the compositional aspects as I process the image. The reaction to something I thought may suit when viewing through the viewfinder is often different to that when the image is viewed larger on screen. Something that jumps out to draw the eye away from the composition, feeling I'm after; in a brightly lit shot will likely be cloned away - its quick and efficient.  :tup:  In low light shots burning or some dissolving may be done with an additional mask area, but only where the intrigue aspect warrants the editing time.

Quite frankly, more respect should be given to the photographer by the folk who run photo competitions! If the photographer has masked out an area in any form to the benefit of the shots composition; good on his or her professional ability  :tup: That is what it is all about!

And in general, professional photographers make their decision and edit each shot in the most efficient manner.

So in short and in my opinion, the judges have shown a clear lack in the understanding of 'the Natural editing processes' when working with digital photography and accordingly devalued their own collective ability in judging to a joke.

Or as intimated (by way of my earlier opinion) followed written rules set to trip some contenders, for the chance it may bring a few free articles putting the competition in lights without the advertising spend.

Are there any photography competitions that provide real decent and worthy merit ? Apart from those held here  ;)

The competition was about a picture to show your skills at taking a shot and the composition you used. It wasn't about your skill with Photoshop. I agree with the judges.  :tup:

Offline Beaux Reflets

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The competition was about a picture to show your skills at taking a shot and the composition you used. It wasn't about your skill with Photoshop. I agree with the judges.  :tup:

I agree, photographic competitions should be about the skill in taking a shot and the compositional choices for the subject; and in processing, Cropping and Cloning should be the last resort!

Lets face it, the level in 'photoshopping' skills required for such aspects in activity is pretty elementary  ;) - As an artist I was taught to draw without ever using a rubber to erase any unwanted aspects, and when taking shots (seriously rather than just for a laugh) thankfully I tend to find that there is little need to erase unwanted bits in much of my work.  :tup:

And all of that does not alter my opinion that the judging was a little bit harsh.

   
:beer: Andy

"Light anchors things in place and gives perspective meaning."

The choices we make are rooted in reflection.

http://beauxreflets.blogspot.com/

Offline donoreo

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The competition was about a picture to show your skills at taking a shot and the composition you used. It wasn't about your skill with Photoshop. I agree with the judges.  :tup:

I agree, photographic competitions should be about the skill in taking a shot and the compositional choices for the subject; and in processing, Cropping and Cloning should be the last resort!

Lets face it, the level in 'photoshopping' skills required for such aspects in activity is pretty elementary  ;) - As an artist I was taught to draw without ever using a rubber to erase any unwanted aspects, and when taking shots (seriously rather than just for a laugh) thankfully I tend to find that there is little need to erase unwanted bits in much of my work.  :tup:

And all of that does not alter my opinion that the judging was a little bit harsh.

 
Now you are going into argument territory.   Even in the days of film, there was so much you could do during processing.  Cropping is a basic one.  Ansel Adams was nothing without his dark room work!   Post processing has always been a big part of photography and always will. 

This situation would have been different if NG had not laid out the rules and then did this.   Since they said what was allowed and not allowed I am fine with it. 

Offline Beaux Reflets

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The competition was about a picture to show your skills at taking a shot and the composition you used. It wasn't about your skill with Photoshop. I agree with the judges.  :tup:

I agree, photographic competitions should be about the skill in taking a shot and the compositional choices for the subject; and in processing, Cropping and Cloning should be the last resort!

Lets face it, the level in 'photoshopping' skills required for such aspects in activity is pretty elementary  ;) - As an artist I was taught to draw without ever using a rubber to erase any unwanted aspects, and when taking shots (seriously rather than just for a laugh) thankfully I tend to find that there is little need to erase unwanted bits in much of my work.  :tup:

And all of that does not alter my opinion that the judging was a little bit harsh.

 
Now you are going into argument territory.   Even in the days of film, there was so much you could do during processing.  Cropping is a basic one.  Ansel Adams was nothing without his dark room work!   Post processing has always been a big part of photography and always will. 

This situation would have been different if NG had not laid out the rules and then did this.   Since they said what was allowed and not allowed I am fine with it.

The irony is that I have always had a higher opinion of the NG and the high standard of photography published there in. Truth be known it is probably why I took up photography (and before moving to France I had a large number of them sitting in my book case spanning quite a few years as they formed part of an uncle's collection). I raise my cap to the togs who's images grace/d its pages and I feel sure many of those images were and are manipulated to their best portrayal of the subject matter.

In my opinion, the old adage that 'any publicity is good publicity' no longer holds towards an increased in point of sale returns - but then maybe I'm just getting fussy and cynical as age creeps up.
:beer: Andy

"Light anchors things in place and gives perspective meaning."

The choices we make are rooted in reflection.

http://beauxreflets.blogspot.com/

 

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