Camera Craniums

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: anglefire on November 24, 2009, 10:19:05 PM

Title: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: anglefire on November 24, 2009, 10:19:05 PM
I've found a site with some real pictures taken with a pre-production MkIV - with some high ISO shots too. Well, if you consider ISO12800 high anyway.

Its a wedding tog from Lancashire, so is British and not American for a change!

Being ever so slightly biased, I would say that the IQ is stunning!

http://jeffascough.typepad.com/jeff_ascough_blog/2009/11/canon-1dmkiv-at-a-wedding.html

Anyone got £4500 spare? :2funny:
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: picsfor on November 24, 2009, 10:31:15 PM
interesting shots, must have a look at how my 5D MkII compares because up to 6400 i do not think an extra £3k is worth the improvement.
Single Digic IV on the 5DMkII instead of dual Digic IV on the 1D MKIV.
Focusing will be better in lower light and that would be nice - but for £3k?
Probably for a pro wedding, sports or wildlife tog - but for me - can't find that use myself!
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: oRGie on November 25, 2009, 02:27:58 AM
Amazing bit of kit no doubt :)   now Mark, have you mentioned it to the wife yet, just in passing sort of thing, set the stage, buy some flowers, a nice dinner perhaps, for 4500 perhaps a weekend in Paris...  "ooh perhaps that would be a great trip to test the new camera out that I was thinking of getting, better to shift the mk3 before the second hand prices drop too much, i would be saving us money really" 
 :beer:
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: anglefire on November 25, 2009, 07:13:38 AM
Dunno about Paris, would need to be a bit farther than that I fear!

Actually, its not on my wish list, well, not very high up anyway, at the moment if I'm truly honest. As Picsfor says, its a lot of extra dough over the 5DMkII.
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on November 25, 2009, 04:54:49 PM
Its a wedding tog from Lancashire, so is British and not American for a change!

"A wedding tog from Lancashire" :D.  Before they decided you had to be American to get on the list, Jeff Ascough was rated in the top 10 wedding photographers in the world.

Those are very nice shots indeed and the ISO 12K is pretty amazing.  (It's worth remembering that's a beta camera but I can't imagine high ISO quality getting much worse for prod).  At least a stop better than the D3 and possibly more.  But then the D3 is obsolete as of yesterday  ::).

Guess what I'm going to play with tomorrow......  8)
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Alfonso_Frisk on November 25, 2009, 04:58:42 PM

But then the D3 is obsolete as of yesterday  ::).


Looks like Oldboy will be spending again soon then.
RR
Alf
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on November 25, 2009, 04:59:44 PM
Just spotted this on YouTube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9QKU2TOo5w

When you realise what it is your jaw kind of drops.
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: alan1572 on November 25, 2009, 07:24:51 PM
not knowing that much, i'd have thought that you would get full frame for that kind of money, i suppose the mkv will be or will that be the mkmk1V.2?
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: anglefire on November 25, 2009, 07:31:13 PM
Yes it will be interesting to see how the IV and D3s compare. Mind you, its getting pretty academic for most of us!

Alan, Canon always seem to bring the 1DMkxx before the 1DsMkxx. The s signifying full frame on the 1D series.

Expectation is that is announced in the spring sometime - probably 32Mp or so. Getting stupid is the Mp now.

I suppose one argument is that the bigger the Mp, the smaller the size of the "noise" is at high ISO. But I'm sure others will disagree!

Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Oldboy on November 25, 2009, 09:31:04 PM

But then the D3 is obsolete as of yesterday  ::).


Looks like Oldboy will be spending again soon then.
RR
Alf

Nope, I don't think the D3 is obsolete as it does what it says on the tin.  :tup:
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on November 25, 2009, 09:48:08 PM

But then the D3 is obsolete as of yesterday  ::).


Looks like Oldboy will be spending again soon then.
RR
Alf

Nope, I don't think the D3 is obsolete as it does what it says on the tin.  :tup:

Um yeah.  But the D3S is now shipping.  AFAIK no more D3s are being made.  Very soon it will no longer be a current camera :(
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Oldboy on November 25, 2009, 10:28:24 PM

But then the D3 is obsolete as of yesterday  ::).


Looks like Oldboy will be spending again soon then.
RR
Alf

Nope, I don't think the D3 is obsolete as it does what it says on the tin.  :tup:

Um yeah.  But the D3S is now shipping.  AFAIK no more D3s are being made.  Very soon it will no longer be a current camera :(

That sounds good as it will become a collectors piece.  :2funny: :2funny: :2funny:
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on November 26, 2009, 07:44:52 AM
Nah I think most of them have been used a little which will decrease their value as antiques.  If the rubber's still sticking to your camera you need to get out more :)
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Oldboy on November 26, 2009, 06:44:56 PM
Nah I think most of them have been used a little which will decrease their value as antiques.  If the rubber's still sticking to your camera you need to get out more :)

Well if you look after your equipment it will still look good whilst almost at 100,000 pictures.  ;D
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on November 26, 2009, 09:51:20 PM
Well if you look after your equipment it will still look good whilst almost at 100,000 pictures.  ;D

Ah, so yours is hardly broken in then.  Nikon techs cleaned mine for me today but didn't bother regluing the rubber - I guess it would only come off again.

In other news, I got to play with a D3S (and of course I ran it at 100K ISO and shot video) the new 70 - 200 (which I liked more than I thought I would) and a D3X (which I didn't get to try at all properly - no light in the room to explore its sensor).  Then I got to play with a big boys' camera.  And that was mighty nice indeed.  I'll get some snaps up tomorrow.
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: picsfor on November 26, 2009, 10:13:14 PM
just so glad you're so willing to suffer for our benefits Joanthan.
Not sure i could take testing all that new kit  :'(
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Oldboy on November 26, 2009, 11:04:26 PM
Well if you look after your equipment it will still look good whilst almost at 100,000 pictures.  ;D

Ah, so yours is hardly broken in then. 


It's broken in but not in pieces!  :2funny:




Nikon techs cleaned mine for me today but didn't bother regluing the rubber - I guess it would only come off again.

In other news, I got to play with a D3S (and of course I ran it at 100K ISO and shot video) the new 70 - 200 (which I liked more than I thought I would) and a D3X (which I didn't get to try at all properly - no light in the room to explore its sensor).  Then I got to play with a big boys' camera.  And that was mighty nice indeed.  I'll get some snaps up tomorrow.

Sounds like you had a great time.  ;D
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on November 27, 2009, 08:34:41 AM
OK looks like I need some new s/w.  My current LR can't open the D3S raws (cheers Nikon) and for a few of them the ISO isn't shown.  Which probably means it's over 12,000.  Files look kind of nice but c'mon Nikon - give us something to point the cameras at!!!  Like all Nikon bashes it was held in a yellowish hotel room filled with blokes who spend more time behind the camera than in front of it.  And no flash.  Very very disappointed in my shots with the D3X as without light this just looks like a P&S.  With a little lighting it would probably rock.

Really really wish I could have taken the D3X along to the Hasselblad studio I was at next.  Now that would have been a head to head.  I'd be really interested if a D3X can really keep up with an entry level H3D.  My guess is no.  (There's a snap with an H3D in the gallery).

2 surprises from the day:
1. OMG the video.  Wow.  I was shooting video in a dark room using the new 70 - 200 VR and it looks absolutely beautiful.
2. The new 70 - 200.  I was expecting this to be just a nip and tuck to the old one.  The VR seems to be staggering.  Here's a shot at 200mm on a D3S, f4 ISO 640 and.....1/13s.  I wasn't taking a lot of care with this.  Taking my time I could probably have held it a stop slower.  Check out the water drops on the car poster.

(http://homepage.mac.com/jonathan_ryan/filechute/_D3S9524.jpg)
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: picsfor on November 27, 2009, 07:00:11 PM
And your thoughts on the new Leica?

Are you likely to get a go?
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on November 28, 2009, 12:38:52 PM
And your thoughts on the new Leica?

Are you likely to get a go?

Probably not.  I no longer get invited to press launches.

Nikon was  a pro day for the D3S with some assorted toys kicking around.  Most of the guys in the room (and yes, they were pretty much all men) seemed to be press and sport photographers.  There was a flurry of panic that one sports organisation has apparently banned any DSLRs that can shoot video from their events.....

The Hassy day was just a play day - you can register on their site for an invite.  But I was impressed.  Very impressed.....
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: anglefire on November 28, 2009, 12:41:46 PM
I've heard there are a few issues with TV rights with DSLR's - must mean that they are pretty worried about either the quality of the output - or the speed at which it could be uploaded and released to the masses.
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: picsfor on November 28, 2009, 12:50:48 PM
the ability to upload with the same convenience as stills will in principal cause them something to worry about but...

and this is the big but (for now)

mobile broad band is just not fast enough. 15 mins on a 5D MkII takes 4gb, and at 7.2mb (that's bits not bytes) max and in reality only 2mb or less - that's an awful long time to not only sustain a connection but upload 4gb (bytes not bits) at the same time!

With video streaming what it is nowadays - i'm not sure there is a return for outlay at the moment.

A few years down the line might be a different ball game!
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Forseti on November 28, 2009, 01:28:45 PM

15 mins on a 5D MkII takes 4gb.............

But soon you'll have 24p.........(think video link in 7D thread)  :legit:
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: picsfor on November 28, 2009, 01:52:40 PM
i was aware of the 24p from the video link (how could i not be  :))but i'm not sure how this will affect resources.
The 15 min quoted on a 4gb card was what came out of the reviews when the 5D MkII was first released.

I have always said that i am not overly bothered about video - but it keeps knocking on my door, and i think at some point i will have to bite the bullet and give it a go!
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on November 28, 2009, 05:58:54 PM
I've heard there are a few issues with TV rights with DSLR's - must mean that they are pretty worried about either the quality of the output - or the speed at which it could be uploaded and released to the masses.

I'd guess it's more to do with TV rights and/or a desire to make more money.

I don't think it's a coincidence that this news broke after both Nikon and Canon nailed their colours to the mast and said "yeah, all top end DSLRs will have video".  It's literally inconceivable that both Nikon and Canon will be locked out of the Olympics (or World Cup for that matter) and so a deal will obviously be reached.  I'll bet that deal involves money.
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: alan1572 on November 30, 2009, 07:57:26 PM
Jonathan, will it be a problem for models when the picture shows up every detail good and bad?
I know when sky went HD news reader's weren't too happy with the clarity it showed them in.
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: anglefire on November 30, 2009, 09:36:58 PM
Jonathan, will it be a problem for models when the picture shows up every detail good and bad?
I know when sky went HD news reader's weren't too happy with the clarity it showed them in.

I'm obviously not Jonathan, but my opinion is that nothing will change - Medium format has been around for years and photoshop has been used to remove the bleamishes for years. Our friends from over the pond, seem particularly keen on making every girl have perfect skin! You just need to look in the glamour section on Photography on the net (Yes this is a largely Canon forum, before anyone makes that comment again  :2funny:)

Now, when we get medium format cameras with1080p video - that might cause a stir!
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: Jonathan on December 01, 2009, 08:38:29 AM
Jonathan, will it be a problem for models when the picture shows up every detail good and bad?

No ;).

You need to remember that this wasn't "future tech" I was playing with.  The H3D II was launched over 2 years ago.  The H4D will be available in January.  This was also the entry level model.  It has 31 million pixels.  There's a 39 and a 50 MP model.  The H4D will have 60 million pixels.  Yep, nearly 3X as many as a D3X.

Cameras in use in the fashion industry for several years have been able to reveal astonishing levels of detail.  The models just have to deal with it :)

The cameras do seem to deliver exceptionally clean looking files that allow for easy retouch.  Plus, models aren't generally chosen for having bad skin.

Here's a tiny crop of the image I posted in the gallery.  It's 1:1 - I cut a 1,000 pixel square out of the image.  Notice how nice the tones and transitions are.

Here's the entire workflow for the image:
1. Shoot and import to Phocus (H's proprietary software which delivers "best results" from .fff files).  All sliders at default (everything at zero and sharpness at 100 (out of 1,000).
2. Set white balance from grey card shot I took.
3. Reduce exposure by 0.31 EV
4. Export to 8 bit tiff
5. Open in Photoshop (this is because I'm not used to Phocus - you can probably do everything there)
6. Convert to sRGB (because I got my export settings wrong)
7. Crop 1,000 pixel square
8. Save for web at quality 60.

Note the lack of skin softening or image sharpening ;)

(http://homepage.mac.com/jonathan_ryan/filechute/Closeup_1237226.jpg)

Here's (http://cameracraniums.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=lastup&cat=10012&pos=0) the full size image.
Title: Re: Real world Pictures from a Canon 1DMkIV
Post by: picsfor on December 01, 2009, 08:59:00 AM
An amazing cut out - and clearly showing why fashion uses medium.

But to be honest, the 21mp sensors are producing detail is worrying for people. The D3x, The 1Ds MkIII, the 5DMkII and the Sony A900 - all with 20+ are producing images with so much detail that post processing will have to be increased to appease the subjects - that or buy a soft focus lens!

This level of detail is the new norm - we will all just have to live with it! When you can capture it at 102400 iso - that will be the real worry ???