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Computer related questions => PC computer questions, tips and how to's => Topic started by: Trickee on October 25, 2009, 04:05:49 PM

Title: Windows 7
Post by: Trickee on October 25, 2009, 04:05:49 PM
anyone got it? what are your first impressions :)?
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: skellum on October 25, 2009, 04:11:43 PM
anyone got it? what are your first impressions :)?

Got an e.mail from Sony Vario saying I could now order it for my new laptop but there will be a charge for distribution / postage ( I dont know how much yet ) I will enquire later....... :legit:
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Mick on October 25, 2009, 04:34:18 PM
Dave, it should be about £12 the last time I checked.  Also it will be a full clean install version and not the upgrade, so you'll have to format to install.  Or that's how I read it.  ;)

I haven't ordered my free windows 7 yet.  :-[
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on October 25, 2009, 06:15:26 PM
Toshiba offered me Windows 7 for £29 all in.

The way i read it was that they would be supplying me with the 'Toshiba' version...

I would rather have the clean install and build from scratch so i can understand what to tell others who may ask.
I haven't received anything yet but then there has been a postal strike!
It's hard for me to get excited this time round as i'm now a Mac convert. I'm only doing it because i help some people with there computing issues.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: happypaddler on October 26, 2009, 10:54:52 AM
You mean no body has held a Windows 7 Party  HERE?  :legit: (http://video.google.com/videosearch?client=safari&rls=en&q=Windows+7+Party&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=LYDlSraqNdGfjAecmrmhBA&sa=X&oi=video_result_group&ct=title&resnum=7&ved=0CCUQqwQwBg#[/url)
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on October 28, 2009, 09:32:25 PM
I've been playing with the Beta for about a year. Similar issues to Vista, finding software that would install properly. Some stuff just refuses outright to recognize there is a Windows 7.  :'(

The final RC is supposed to be good until July 2010 so I'm going to wait until more software compatibility issues have been resolved.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: pocketwitch on November 07, 2009, 12:12:33 PM
I'm waiting for the Acer version to arrive, apparently they are "snowed" under with requests and are running 3 weeks behind!  I have a feeling that it's just not going to be as simple as upgrading the Mac was, why do I put myself through these things lol!  :doh:
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: anglefire on November 07, 2009, 01:00:49 PM
I "upgraded" my fathers computer last weekend from Xp - was a bit of a nightmare actually!

The advisor said there were no issues.

But a boot from DVD wouldn't work becuase it couldn't find a driver for one of the CD drives. Period. No ignore.

So had to do it from within windows - and it did install but now one of the CD drives doesn't work.

The printer worked once I'd got a new driver, so that wasn't a major problem.

It now says the documents drive is about to fail - which is possible, as I can't read at least one file off the drive. Its all backed up so that is not a major problem apart from it needs a new one.

The video card doesn't have a better driver than the standard VGA one apparently - so some things are somewhat slooooowwwww. Like the Windows Card games!

IE 8 is giving grief - it won't load some stuff - like my mothers census files off the net - that was fixed by downloading firefox and it said that it needed a Adobe plugin- got that and that sorted it out.

Before downloading firefox though, I tried Safari - it wouldn't download at all! Said thanks for doing so!

So I think that they are going to use firefox!

Not impressed!
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: stevebedder on November 07, 2009, 02:09:05 PM
I installed Win 7 on my laptop and workstation this week and both went without a hitch and am really loving the new OS now!

If I had to gripe about anything, the only thing (so far) I would gripe about is the number of automatic updates that are required. Its not a big thing as I had it set to download and install automatically so it just ran in the background.

Th UI is so much better than Vista, much more logical and usable.

I did a fresh install on both machines and I don't think it took longer than 15 minutes each from inserting the DVD to logging in for the first time. It's taken a bit longer to get all the other apps installed and configured though. Was suprised that the only driver I cannot find a working version of is the one for my in-built Teac CA200 13-in-1 media card reader. The drives still work, it just doesn't show the drive icons in My Coputer (although they are listed in Disk Management).

My graphics card, all-in-one printer, sound, Wacom tablet etc all worked first time.

The OS is pretty fast too, certainly faster that Vista in my experience.

Must say that so far I am mightly impressed with Windows 7 thus far.

Steve
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on November 07, 2009, 06:29:38 PM
i'm told that i should not expect mine before 23rd November.

I'm heartbroken!
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Tripod on November 08, 2009, 10:01:54 AM
Was suprised that the only driver I cannot find a working version of is the one for my in-built Teac CA200 13-in-1 media card reader. The drives still work, it just doesn't show the drive icons in My Coputer (although they are listed in Disk Management).

Steve. The card driver must have loaded OK. Windows 7 does not show drive icons unless a card is inserted. Makes sense really as you may know it could become a head scratcher looking for the card slot you were using in Vista.
Documented somewhere.........

John
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Tripod on November 08, 2009, 12:34:48 PM
Put Windows 7 on desktop and laptop and my THUMBS are up. Not an easy install for me. Followed all the advices, but ended up doing fresh installs on both machines. Made all backups first of course...... I've a further laptop which I'm leaving alone with XP on it.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on November 08, 2009, 02:29:59 PM
Local big box business store is offering what they call the family pack. Licenced for installation on 3 PC's. So before purchasing one I decided to down load the Win7 advisor program, to find any issues. I've downloaded the "english" version twice and both times it tried to install in what is either Hebrew or gibberish.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: stevebedder on November 08, 2009, 03:01:32 PM
Steve. The card driver must have loaded OK. Windows 7 does not show drive icons unless a card is inserted. Makes sense really as you may know it could become a head scratcher looking for the card slot you were using in Vista.

Thanks John just tried this out now and it does exactly as you say  :tup

Steve

Edit - Just found this bit of info too...

Display your drives
Click Computer in Windows 7 and you might see a strange lack of drives, but don't panic, it's just Microsoft trying to be helpful: drives like memory card readers are no longer displayed if they're empty. We think it's an improvement, but if you disagree then it's easy to get your empty drives back. Launch Explorer, click Tools > Folder Options > View and clear 'Hide empty drives in the computer folder'.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on November 09, 2009, 01:36:40 AM
Bought the family pac version. Annoyed to find out I can't upgrade a 32 bit version to 64 bit. >:( Don't know how long it took to install as I went out to dinner and left it to do it's business. Not surprised to find all of my settings in place as promised...except of course Firefox and Thunderbird. Cheek.  ::)
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Trickee on November 11, 2009, 11:48:34 AM
Are all you lucky W7 users finding that your applications are running faster?
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on November 11, 2009, 09:13:26 PM
Hardly, damn upgrade has crashed my main PC. It installed on my laptop fine but got all the way to finalizing the settings and stopped. I'm trying to restore Vista now.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on December 04, 2009, 10:25:09 PM
OK - the upgeade disc finally arrived, and failed to work as Toshiba said.
Put this disc in and follow the instructions, uninstall this, then that - change this setting then that.

I put the disc in and booted to CD and performed a fresh install. I have to say i was impressed with how simple the install process was.
Haven't seen antything that simple since DOS 6.22!

Sadly, that was where my joy ended.
I am now writing this from a Windows 7 equipped laptop - and it is bloody horrible.
If i ever get hold of any of those morons on TV telling that Windows 7 was their idea i'll bloody swing for them.
It's bloody horrible - i loathe it with a vengeance. Awful muck.
Worse still it came with IE pre-installed. I thought they weren't allowed to do that as part of an EU ruling?
Needless to say it will be toast before the weekend is out and i move over to Firefox...
Now i need to starrt installing other software so i can moan about it even more. Where's a Mac when you need one?
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on December 05, 2009, 12:18:40 AM
I have to say, my other two upgrades insalled flawlessly.  :-[
It does seem faster than Vista.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: anglefire on December 05, 2009, 07:28:32 AM
My dads PC is now working ok on W7 - though I had to put in a new video card as the one it had in was so old I couldn't find drivers for it, so just playing solitare (My mothers favourite game!) was just so slow!

And the motherboard has extended IDE channels - also not supported, so one drive can't been seen in W7 - none of which were mentioned as problems when the compatability program was run!

Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Al Birmingham on December 05, 2009, 08:50:57 AM
In my humble experience all versions of Windows run faster when newly installed. Things return to normal after a few weeks once the cache has got clogged up. I shall wait a while before upgrading.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on December 05, 2009, 09:23:12 AM
In my humble experience all versions of Windows run faster when newly installed. Things return to normal after a few weeks once the cache has got clogged up. I shall wait a while before upgrading.
Yes quite agree - it always does run faster on a new install.
For all the fuss they had trying to make W7 comply with EU directives, it is the most Microsoft centric version of windows so far.
Media Player and IE being shoved in my face in more than in previous versions (both subject of EU investigations) and the ability to switch back to classic view seems to have disappeared.
So now i'm stuck with having to make sense of the newer menu system - which i never liked in the first place.

They've clearly tried to implement some of the better Apple ideas to varying success, and i've not had any hardware or software issues so far.
That said, the laptop is less than 6 months old so i think it was already configured for W7 to a degree, and most of my software is pretty much standard stuff - no freebies or work round software.
I have also set about uninstalling as much as possible. Even without the Manufacturer muck - Windows installs enough tat of its own and off loading any unnecessary stuff will always help it run better.
No different from the days of DOS when you had to configure your base memory to get as close to 640k as possible - now it's unloading as much unnecessary software and options as possible.

Oh yes, a good thing - better report them as i find them cos i'm not expecting to find too many.
The wireless internet set up is vastly improved over previous versions. On install it prompted me with all the wireless set ups and offered to configure it all with the aid of a required password or similar.
A huge improvement over Vista or even XP/ 2000.

Ah well, i'm destressing now, cos i'm writing this from my Mac!  :D
 
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Malcolm1938 on December 05, 2009, 10:56:41 AM
I run 2 computers

!. Fujitsu Siemens Laptop running Vista with a copyright date of 2005
2 An Archos Netbook running XP with a copyright date of 2005

I still get regular updates for both of these fully 5 years after the copyright date suggesting that they are still not perfect  so what makes anyone think that Windows 7 can really be finished.

When asked about new operating systems I usually say dont even consider it before SP2 is launched and even then it will not be finished.

I dont care how much faster an operating system is claimed to be - If it can save me a few minutes in a day I would not know what to do with  the time it saved. To me a good operating systems are about reliability - not speed.


Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on December 05, 2009, 12:33:31 PM
Sadly, i have people who i help with their computer stuff - and the questions have been asked.
For £20+ i'm hardly gonna pass up the opportunity to try it out...

I didn't expect miracles because ultimately we are still talking about a system built around the x86 architecture from way back when my daughters were the age of my youngest grandson - and he's still in nappies. What was even more obvious about this release was the absence of an included e-mail application. A way of getting people to buy into 'Office' or sign up to the Windows Cloud computing ideal maybe? Not that i wish to sound cynical! What the heck - i am being cynical!

Well, back to the Mac - enough testing and learning for one day. I have pictures to process and high scores to achieve! 
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: anglefire on December 05, 2009, 04:52:02 PM
No email client? I can't say I'd noticed - though thinking about it, it did say Outlook express wasn't included - though I did assume something was!

Whilst I don't necessarily think that you should be tied into what the OS provides, I think the basics should be - but easily removable if not required.

To be honest, why aren't Apple being done by the anti-competition lot? I mean, it comes with pretty much everything built in.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on December 05, 2009, 04:53:39 PM
well to honest, I simply wanted to take advantage of this new 3 licence family pack as my daughter was talking about getting Win 7 for her PC and I had been running the RC version already on my 2nd PC and it expires in july of 2010.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on December 06, 2009, 10:09:22 AM
To be honest, why aren't Apple being done by the anti-competition lot? I mean, it comes with pretty much everything built in.
I think the approach to how the 2 companies do business is somewhat different.
It's hard to accuse Apple of accusing their monopolistic position when they command such a small share of the market!
Also, i think Apple have sailed very closely to the legal muddy waters on a few occasions but have responded to public opinion before it got that far.
Finally, i do not think Apple inhibit people developing for their platform or demand that suppliers include Apple stuff when selling the kit.

Now go into PC Wold and see what he Windows variety come with.
The phrase 'WINtel' was not coined for fun - it reminds us that 2 companies almost have total control on the home computing market.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: SimonW on December 07, 2009, 09:24:10 AM
VIRGIN !

I've upgraded one of "my" (office) machines from Vista to Windows 7 and assisted with several others, and they're all the better for it, the upgrade being simple and trouble free. But helping one neighbour, the installation stopped almost at once and reported that it could not proceed until we first removed Kaspersky. I know that's an anti-virus thing, but the machine did not have it installed; it used software supplied by the ISP and branded by them - Virgin. A call to Virgin (quickly and efficiently answered) confirmed that their security software was not compatible with Windows 7 and they expected issue a fix by late December. So we can't do the upgrade till then. I'm only mentioning this in case it might help anyone else using Virgin software - you might initially be as puzzled as we were.

(And full marks to Windows 7 for preventing an upgrade which might have caused all sorts of trouble.)
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on December 07, 2009, 09:35:21 AM
Isn't that strange - i have Kaspersky and when trying out the initial upgrade install it mentioned nothing about that.
Historically i have fond Virgin to be slower at supporting upgrades to OS - but when they do - they seem to know their stuff.

But i'll bet your info will save a lot of frustrated and broken hearts.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on December 07, 2009, 12:22:35 PM
Is it just me, or have any of you experienced changes to how some software works post Win7 upgrade vs. pre Win7? I've found a couple of programs seem to have been altered? The latest was Audacity. It's not that they stopped working it's that their workflows appear to have changed.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on December 07, 2009, 01:39:20 PM
At this stage i still haven't had a chance to use it much.
All i've done is some use of Firefox for internet browsing and installed a copy of Settlers which is an older game to see how it handles it. Thus far it has handled it without a problem.
Kaspersky loves it (the genuine one not the Virgin branded one) and Office 2007 hasn't batted an eye lid.

It seems to boot up noticeably quicker at this stage and it has a much better defrag application than on Vista.
But - the update downloads are coming in thick and fast. At this rate in a month i'll have to re-build it...

I might persuade my self to give it a real go one day - but i'm still in love with my Mac!
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Mick on February 05, 2010, 06:33:22 PM
Got my free Acer windows 7 upgrade a few days ago.  Been a bit reluctant to install it yet though.

A couple of questions to those who have gone through the upgrade process.

I downloaded and run the upgrade adviser, and it told me I have a couple of problems to sort out.  One was a nvidia stereoscopic driver.  The other was the fact that I haven't got windows live mail installed.  Surprised to see there's no email program included with 7 

It showed I have ten programs that are compatible with windows 7.

What about all the other programs I have installed, no mention of those at all.   Do I have to remove them first, and re-install after the upgrade.  Or just leave them and see if they work afterwards.

Also have any of you done this upgrade on a Acer Aspire desktop?  My upgrade comes as two DVDs, and the instructions on Acer's website don't mention two disks.  And have conflicting instructions.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on February 05, 2010, 07:14:19 PM
Mick,

mine came by way of a Toshiba upgrade disk.Told me to do what you've done and oh it didn't half talk some rubbish.

So, having made sure i had no data of worth - i stuck the upgrade disk in and ran it is a clean install, formatting the hard drive along the way.
The installation went as cleanly as a Mac rebuild - without a hitch. Completed in about 15 minutes i think it was.

I then proceeded to re-install the few programs that still get used with Windows which despite MS warnings have all worked like a dream.
i have had to install an old copy of Outlook to deal with any e-mail issues.

The reason there is no e-mail program is because they (Microsoft) want you to adopt the "Windows Live" and cloud computing way of life.
I have never had a Hotmail or any other MS mail account and first thing i done once the install was completed was uninstall IE and install Firefox.
I then went into Firefox and Kaspersky as i have always done and told them that as far as possible Hotmail and IE are evil nasty things that should never cross it's path and added Windows Live just to make sure.

The only thing that annoys me for which i can find no fix is that when ever i log onto this site and play something in the arcade some stupid back up regime seems to feel a need to operate and interrupt the activity.
Irritates the hell out of me.

That aside - i have to be honest and say it has worked without a hitch - for a Microsoft Windows OS. Certainly as solid as Win 2K or XP when installed on suitable computers.  
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on February 05, 2010, 10:46:44 PM
Got my free Acer windows 7 upgrade a few days ago.  Been a bit reluctant to install it yet though.

A couple of questions to those who have gone through the upgrade process.

I downloaded and run the upgrade adviser, and it told me I have a couple of problems to sort out.  One was a nvidia stereoscopic driver.  The other was the fact that I haven't got windows live mail installed.  Surprised to see there's no email program included with 7 

It showed I have ten programs that are compatible with windows 7.

What about all the other programs I have installed, no mention of those at all.   Do I have to remove them first, and re-install after the upgrade.  Or just leave them and see if they work afterwards.

Also have any of you done this upgrade on a Acer Aspire desktop?  My upgrade comes as two DVDs, and the instructions on Acer's website don't mention two disks.  And have conflicting instructions.

After my upgrade some programs worked the way they had on Vista, some had to be reinstalled and some were there but not on the start menu and all I had to do was find the launching file double click it to get the program running and after that it showed up in the menu. In retrospect, I probably reinstalled a couple of programs I didn't need to, I just couldn't find them at first.

As to the Mail program, the one in Vista was an abysmal failure and yes they are pushing their cloud applications. If you like firefox, download thunderbird it works a great deal like Outlook Express did.

You have two discs because Windows now ships both the 32 bit program and the 64 bit together. I've got 32 bit on one machine and 64 bit on another. I haven't seen any worthwhile performance increase with 64 bit and to be honest there isn't a whole lot of 64 bit software out there anyway.

I can't speak to the specifics of your Acer, but I installed one upgrade on a Gateway Desktop, a Gateway laptop and a custom built rig and all went fine. They've been up and running since Christmas with no issues.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on February 05, 2010, 10:50:07 PM
One codicil, if you have any usb peripherals leave them disconnected until you do the upgrade. For some reason that throws a wrench into the install. My desktop currently has 4 external HD's and two Printers attached. The install hung until I turned them all off, then went ahead as expected. Once done and running I turned them all back on and they loaded without incident.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: SimonW on February 06, 2010, 09:24:36 AM
Maybe not strictly a Windows 7 issue, but perhaps a small note of caution:-

I recently bought a new Dell laptop with Windows 7 after confirming that Elements 8 and ProShow would run on it. They both installed and ran OK - no bother at all with Elements including making backup DVDs and slide show CDs. But Proshow hit a snag - it does not see the optical drive and therefore I cannot create CDs of any sort with it. Their very helpful and persistent support team tried everything and in the end said Proshow does not support my particular optical drive - which is a bog standard "old tech" DVD+/-RW, no double sided or blueray.

(ProShow can generate an ISO disk image, so I hope to find some burning software which can turn this into a CD, but haven't got there yet.)
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on February 06, 2010, 10:00:21 AM
Simon - I don't want to stray too far OT here but the answer to your problem might well lie somewhere else -  I won't get too technical because in all honesty I don't understand a lot of it myself LOL, but anyway. The problem can lie in (a) the codecs installed on the machine or/and (b) another programme capturing the burning device. A while back now on an old PC running XP I was no longer able to burn CD's/DVD's from WMP and after many hours of net searching discovered that the problem lay in Nero's InCid not allowing other applications access to the burner. Once this unnecessary application was removed WMP once more had access to the burner. More recently (on my present PC - also XP) another application - Sony Vegas was unable to access the internal burner although with a separate external USB burner it could. In this case, and after several telephone conversations with Sony support I was advised that many applications install codecs packages and most users (including me) aren't aware that old one's should first be removed. This also includes codecs that camera manufacturers install/as well as the OS allowing one to view images etc. The advice given in this case was (a) to access the start up programmes via msconfig and one by one to disable them, reboot the system and try the burner again. This method, whilst time consuming allows one to discover and eliminate which applications are accessing the burner and basically taking it over denying other applications access to it. The second method, and the one that worked for me was to locate all the codecs on the PC, remove them followed by installing a complete codecs package that is readily available on the web.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Mick on February 08, 2010, 12:27:33 AM
Well I did the upgrade yesterday.  Surprisingly all my files are still intact, and all my programs seem to be working too.  Even the ones that were not down as compatible.

Took a while going the upgrade route, but not as long as having to reinstall all my files and programs would have done.

Happy so far.   :o
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on February 08, 2010, 09:37:31 AM
Glad to hear it all went OK Mick and you are still operational so to speak.
I think many of the MS warnings about compatibility are excessive caution.

They (MS) got their fingers well and truly burned with Vista and i think this time they've taken the opposite line. It seems fairly stable to me - but I just do not like the new interface.
But, in true Microsoft fashion, they've designed it so you are going to (as far as they can enforce such a thing) sign up to "their" version of modern computing.
Fortunately the EU have passed a few rulings which have almost negated their ability to enforce such a policy. Choice of browser, e-mail client and music player really are down to you to choose  :tup:
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on March 22, 2010, 04:32:00 PM
OK then, having run Windows Upgrade Advisor my system seems good to go for either the 32 or 64 bit versions of Windows 7. The question is, for a current XP user which one of the several options should one choose? I know that I'd want the Professional version but having taken a quick look on Amazon I'm left scratching my head somewhat. For English readers here's the link to the Amazon UK site - http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B002DGS82G/ref=s9_simh_gw_p65_i1?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_s=center-1&pf_rd_r=1T55F4C9W17RSPRWF01R&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=467198433&pf_rd_i=468294 - please take a look at Customer Review #2 by Dr. Norman W. Poole who it would appear was mislead by Amazon.

Whilst the PC scan suggests that from a hardware point of view my system is OK, it threw up a few software compatibility issues. A couple such as Microsoft RAW image viewer I can live without as I use another codecs application for viewing RAW thumbnail images in Explorer so that, and a couple of others, I'm not too concerned with. Another non compatible is Canons Internet Library Zoombrowser EX v1.6.39 which takes up over 100MB of hard drive on my PC. I don't even know what this is exactly but am reluctant to delete it via Add/Remove Programmes as it might interfere with Zoombrowser itself. Can anyone help in this particular regard.

Essential applications are of course Lightroom and Photoshop which are currently running on my 32 bit system. With Lightroom I know that there is a 64 bit installer and I can quite happily use the existing licence provided. But what about Photoshop - does the supplied DVD also allow for 64 bit installs and would one need to 'Deactivate' it within the XP OS first prior to reinstalling using the W7 installation?

Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on March 22, 2010, 05:14:52 PM
Forseti,

Photoshop would need to be de-activated before uninstalling from your current computer configuration. That is standard since the intro of CS2.
As for the 32/64 bit issue i can't help.
LR installs without any hitch and you would just select the 64 bit version.

I'm taking it from your enquiry that your system is fully 64bit compliant? If not then i would stick with the 32 bit version - it does still seem to fly along with 4gb ram and a reasonable processor on the laptop.
My only comment of certainty here is that you should perform a clean install and not mess about using the upgrade path - most of the problems upgrading come from this path.
Clean installs tend to work much better and only requires you to put your old XP DVD in the drive for verification purposes.

Of importance to note - Windows 7 does not come with a mail program, so i suggest you had better make sure you have one or your current one can be installed.

And finally - it most definitely was NOT my idea! As said before, if it was my idea Apple and Linux would be history  8) :tup:
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: spinner on March 22, 2010, 07:28:20 PM
Forseti,

I've installed both the 32 bit version and the 64 bit version on reasonably compatible systems (if anything the 64 bit system is slightly better). Frankly I can't see any difference in how they process data. And other than high end software like photoshop, most other stuff is still only 32 bit.

And why are you leaning towards the professional version? Unless you run a network, home or otherwise, you're buying features designed for system administrators to track and evaluate multiple systems and users.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Mick on March 22, 2010, 07:28:36 PM

please take a look at Customer Review #2 by Dr. Norman W. Poole who it would appear was mislead by Amazon.


Not sure he was mislead, the info is Here (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/feature.html/ref=amb_link_85059153_2?ie=UTF8&docId=1000339313&pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_s=special-product-offers-1&pf_rd_r=070X6VKTKCSF01PQ0E0X&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_p=473302013&pf_rd_i=B002DGS82G)  And as far as I'm aware you've never been able to do a upgrade install of windows 7 from XP.  You have to do a custom install ( in other words clean install) .  This wipes your data.

If on the other hand you had vista, then you can do a upgrade install as I did, and all your programs and data remain.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on March 22, 2010, 08:10:21 PM
And why are you leaning towards the professional version? Unless you run a network, home or otherwise, you're buying features designed for system administrators to track and evaluate multiple systems and users.

Excellent point that chap - stick with the home premium version. It's cheaper and does all you need.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Mick on March 22, 2010, 08:57:02 PM

And why are you leaning towards the professional version? Unless you run a network, home or otherwise, you're buying features designed for system administrators to track and evaluate multiple systems and users.


Maybe it was for this, Windows XP Mode and Windows Virtual PC (http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtual-pc/)  Only available for Pro / Enterpirise and ultimate versions of windows 7.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on March 22, 2010, 09:25:53 PM
Thanks for all the feedback guys - very helpful. I'll spend time (when available) over the next week going through my PC with a fine tooth comb making a note of what plug-ins I have etc and where they are located exactly. Although the W7 Upgrade Advisor did a good job of reporting any possible conflicts I have quite a few little programmes that weren't reported on at all so the associated web sites need to be visited first.

Good points regarding the Home v Pro editions: I guess that I've just got used to having the Pro version of XP on my three machines but looking at the comparison chart I think the Home Edition would serve me just fine.

32 v 64 bit: again good points and I shall probably continue to run with the 32 bit version that I currently have.

Mail programmes, address books and the likes: have never used them so not something that I shall miss. Thanks for the tip though.

One final question (hopefully  :)) I currently only have the OS (XP) and applications on Drive C (250GB) which is also mirrored to an identical drive. All data, backups of small applications and plug-ins etc are installed on Drive D. All images are on separate EHD's. Upon doing a clean install of W7 will it leave these partitions as is and simply install W7 on the same Drive C?  Also, concerning these mirrored drives of which I know absolutely nothing about other than the fact that they are software mirrored apparently, would the install of W7 respect the mirrored drives?
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on March 23, 2010, 08:21:03 AM
A mirrored drive is created at the boot level with raid drivers (software or hardware) and is very much controlled by the computer independently of the O/S.
Of course there is the obvious point of note - to make sure your raid drivers work with Windows 7!
But i do not see that really being a problem.

Data drive D and EHD's are just that - sources of data that will be mapped to by Windows 7.
Installing any software whether it be application or O/S will require you to tell it where to save data and other bits such as plug ins to etc.
Some of the folders might get "over written" whilst configuring software (Adobe Plug Ins for instance) so it might be a good move to have such things backed up on a separate drive or DVD where as MS Word documents would not be touched. You would just go into MS Word after the install and configure that drive and folder as the data back up point etc.

You have a wealth of people on here that can offer help, i'm sure if you let us know we can take it in turns to be available to answer questions. I am of course assuming you will do 1 computer at a time thus allowing yourself something to remain connected to the internet with. To be honest, i would do the 1 machine and get familiar with windows 7 before attacking the other machines - or at least leave 1 with XP on until you've got to a point where you're happy to abandon XP.

I've got to help a friend update to Windows 7 over the winter months when it is quiet. Her needs area as critical as yours in that her computers "are" her work. She is a mobile worker so has to have 2 laptops to cart around in case of failure and a third at home in case of car theft - and they all have to synch all data to each other and back up to an EHD which can be accessed via the net. The beauty this time is i get a chance to plan this instead of reacting to a crisis such as system failure (she took a single laptop abroad for a week and worked furiously on it without backing up via the net, just to have the H/D fail on boot up back in England - example of crisis).
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on March 23, 2010, 08:49:41 AM
A mirrored drive is created at the boot level with raid drivers (software or hardware) and is very much controlled by the computer independently of the O/S.
Of course there is the obvious point of note - to make sure your raid drivers work with Windows 7!

If I understand you correctly Andrew, what you're saying is that an install of W7 onto Drive C (where XP is currently) will ignore the fact that this is a mirrored drive as this is controlled at boot level. Correct? I'm somewhat confused by you going on to say 'make sure your raid drivers work with W7' which seems to contradict the first part of what you say, namely '........controlled by the computer independently of the OS. Follow on question - where on my system would I locate these drivers and how would I recognise them?

I am of course assuming you will do 1 computer at a time thus allowing yourself something to remain connected to the internet with.

Yes you assume correctly.  :tup: With such a big jump I shall give myself lots of time to adapt to W7 and no doubt it's foibles before committing it to the other 2 machines.

On another note, the German government yesterday released an advisory warning users against using the Firefox browser - typical, just when I've got used to it.  :'( The BBC have also published it on their website and you can read it here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8580716.stm
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on March 23, 2010, 09:33:53 AM
OK, to try and explain a bit more clearly.

Mirrored drives are a feature of a RAID Array.
The point being you have an array of multiple HD's of duplicate size etc and with the help of RAID drivers (either via plug in hardware or motherboard software) you can choose utilise these drives in a way that provides extra system redundancy. In your case - you have 2 drives, 1 of which is configured to mirror the other.
As always with drives, the BIOS is where the full picture is found, and if your RAID system is software based there is a good chance it will be shown in the BIOS and that is where you will see the mirrored drive.

BUT!!!

You do not need to make any changes - do not fiddle with some thing that is working. Have a look to see what RAID drivers you have but you do not need to do anything else in that area.
If one HD is configured to mirror another HD, it will mirror the drive exactly - so that if your main HD has been partitioned to contain 2 separate virtual drives (C and D) then the mirrored drive will also contain that formatting.
This is all done by the computer BIOS and RAID drivers and Windows does not really get involved at all.

Where Windows gets involved is at the boot process. If the original drive fails Windows has to know that you have a mirrored drive and to bring about a swap to the mirrored drive either by rebooting your machine or seamlessly swapping over to it without your knowledge. In either case you would get a warning telling you your primary drive has failed, as would you get a warning telling you your mirrored drive has failed as well.
Hence the statement that you need to check that Windows 7 recognises your RAID  drivers.

I hope that helps a bit.

Firefox 3.6
If you read the additonal blurb on the BBC web site it also tells you to stick with it because swapping browsers on a whim could cause more damage than sticking with the known weak spot. As you are building a new machine - what are the potential hackers (who have probably never heard of you  :-\) going to do? Wipe out your installation of Photoshop or Office on your new computer? Hardly a disaster at this stage!
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on March 23, 2010, 11:39:29 AM
Thanks once again Andrew - it's a lot clearer now. Just for info, I actually have 3 physical drives within the PC's housing. Two of these three drives are mirrored and only show in the system as being Drive C and at system boot (although it happens very quickly) the mirror is shown and checked. It is this drive (Drive C) that contains the OS and applications and nothing else. All personal data files, Lightroom/Photoshop plug-ins etc are located on the third drive (Drive D) and further backed up to an EHD.

The way I see it at the moment, a new install of W7 will go onto Drive C and be automatically be mirrored onto the second drive. I anticipate (and hope) that the third physical drive (Drive D) will play no part in the installation of W7 which of course will make things a lot easier for me. All I then need to do is reinstall the applications (LR/PS etc) onto Drive C and point them in the direction of where the various plug-ins etc are located i.e. Drive D.

If the very worse happens I shall not really lose anything as all the contents of Drive D are backed up onto one of my EHD's anyway including the original .exe files for various applications. For instance, I use Qimage for printing and whilst it is installed on Drive C I actually keep (backup) the .exe files onto Drive D and further backed up to the EHD. Backups I've got a plenty of as you may have gathered  ::). This is also why I chose the option of having Drive C mirrored which I know isn't the norm, but aside from viruses etc should one physical drive fail I wouldn't then have to reinstall everything from scratch.

Unlike Vista which copies everything over, from this thread it has become clear that the XP > W7 route requires a clean install. I suppose in this instance a few telephone calls will need to be made to MS upon reinstalling applications such as Office etc onto the new OS. It might just allow me to re-enter the licence numbers but somehow I doubt it - time will tell.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on March 23, 2010, 12:10:26 PM
Your assumption is correct.
A clean install of dive C from Win XP to Win 7 will only impact on drive C and it's mirrored counterpart.
Driver D which is a separate physical should not be touched - and i would be extremely concerned if it were.
When performing a clean install you are asked which drive you wish to use (C) and that should be the only thing touched. I've never heard of other internal physical drives ever being affected. You configuration is the best recommended for a home machine for redundancy etc.

With respect of installing MS Office - you just re-install form your CD/DVD as usual and install the licence key at the appropriate time. That applies also to LR and PS hence the de-activate of PS licence key for that computer prior to uninstalling. I would certainly have another computer to work on whilst this is happening because otherwise it really will be a case of watching paint dry  :o

Go for it girl - be a PC and make Win 7 your idea  :tup: :)
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on March 23, 2010, 12:58:35 PM
Ordered  :dance: - and now to the business of giving this current set-up the once over making sure that all those little out of the way plug-ins etc are backed up and to go through the Windows Add/Remove programmes list double checking exactly what's installed. Thanks once again, you and other contributors to this thread have been a big help.  ;)
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on March 27, 2010, 10:54:47 AM
Just a quick update folks. The custom install of W7 went problem free thank heavens only taking 50 minutes  :tup: - reinstalling applications was another matter of course.

A few initial observations:

(a) The installation packaging advised, as did the W7 advisor, to back up all your data and applications etc onto removable hardware e.g. EHD's. What's strange though is that once the installation began I received the following message - 'The partition you selected for the installation (C) might contain files from a previous Windows installation. If it does, these files and folders will be moved to a folder named Windows.old. You will be able to access the information in Windows.old but you will not be able to use the previous version of Windows'. Sure enough, a Windows.old folder was created (several gigabytes large) containing all my applications and data files etc and which were accessible. What I can't understand therefore, is the reason for the advisory for backing everything up when Windows 7 did it anyway. Strange!!!

(b) Start up and shut down are now lightening fast and whilst I still have only 2.75GB of memory available (same as XP) the CPU usage appears to be a lot lower. That said, trying to find the system performance shortcut in the first instance proved a bit of a nightmare as pressing Ctrl+Alt+Del now brings up the shut down options for the PC.

(c) Overall, first impressions are favourable although it's going to take a while getting used to the new layout. For instance, I still haven't found a way or place to type in for instance D:\setup.exe when a CD/DVD doesn't run by itself.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: stevebedder on March 27, 2010, 11:41:08 AM
Hi Forseti,

b) just right click on the Windows task bar (usually at the bottom of the screen) and select Start Task Manager and then select the performance tab to see the system performance, memory usage etc.

c) just type whatever you want to run in the search box on the Windows start menu (the one with the magnifying glass). Even though it looks like a search bar it also acts as a run tool. You can add the traditional Run.. tool to the Start menu by right clicking over the Windows icon on the task bar, selecting properties, then Start Menu, then Customise and then puting a tick in the Run option in the list.

HTH

Steve
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on March 27, 2010, 01:11:35 PM
Thanks Steve - easy when you know how isn't it?  :dance:
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Oldboy on March 27, 2010, 06:39:05 PM
What I can't understand therefore, is the reason for the advisory for backing everything up when Windows 7 did it anyway. Strange!!!


That's because the installation may fail before it has created this backup. It's also possible that not all applications may be saved so they always suggest backing up before installation.  :tup:
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: top totty on March 27, 2010, 08:09:42 PM
Evening all, I would just like to know what people think of Windows 7. I bought a laptop at the end of October which ran Vista (which I hate,don't know anything about it, still using XP on other pc) I have only just found out that I was entitled to a free upgrade which the muppet of a salesman forgot to tell me about. They will send me the upgrade but I will have to do it myself.....that's the problem, how easy is it to do :-[
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: hssutton on March 27, 2010, 09:36:46 PM
I ran Windows 7 Beta for several months, but found it to be essentially the same as Vista (in the 2 years of running Vista ultimate I've never experienced any problem), so I'm not going to bother with it.

As for ugrading, well that is childs play, at least it was with the Dell upgrade disk that I did for a friend. The downside being it took approx 6 hours.

Harry
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: top totty on March 27, 2010, 09:42:54 PM
Thanks for that Harry I may not bother withit then.

Janet
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Trickee on March 27, 2010, 09:54:19 PM
i have still not upgraded i increased the ram in my laptop instead which increased the speed of my vista system and i am happy with that. i will wait until i buy a new laptop ;)
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on March 28, 2010, 08:56:19 AM
Thanks for that Harry I may not bother with it then.
Janet

Now for a different take. I got a free upgrade same as you Janet. I performed a clean build which took a little over 3 hours including the installation of all the software and updates. I'm not a fan of putting the upgrade disk in and letting it run, but by all accounts it does a reasonable job - haven't heard too many disaster stories yet.

As for difference and benefits - well your laptop is clearly designed to work with Win 7 which is very different 'under the bonnet'. Win 7 is to Vista what XP is to Win 2K and i heard no end of complaints about Win 2K though i loved it.
The big difference is that all the things that were causing problems with Vista have been taken away and completely re-developed into a far more stable and efficient application.
The fact that the boot up and shut down times are so much quicker is an obvious testament to that. The facility to hook up to a broadband node, whether in your house or out on the road, is a huge improvement over Vista. Whilst their are many other benefits that you will gain i haven't had time to find them all yet - having become a Mac convert.

But i will say this. Whilst i personally never had 'any problems' with Vista  - my over riding view was 'that it is a dog' - where as Win 7 is more of a breath of fresh air. The desk top working environment is organised differently but not in a bad way once you get used to it, though i do miss the ability to swap back to 'classic mode'. So, you should really be using Win 7 to get the most out of your laptop. Business have avoided Vista like the plague and yet they are embracing Win 7 - that should tell you something in itself...

Well that's my opposing 2 penneth worth.


Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Mick on March 28, 2010, 09:31:06 AM
Thanks for that Harry I may not bother with it then.
Janet

Now for a different take. I got a free upgrade same as you Janet. I performed a clean build which took a little over 3 hours including the installation of all the software and updates. I'm not a fan of putting the upgrade disk in and letting it run, but by all accounts it does a reasonable job - haven't heard too many disaster stories yet.



I went the other way and did the upgrade install.  Never taken the upgrade route with previous versions of windows because it always caused problems.   I have to say though I'm well impressed with the way everything went with this.

I ran the supplied disks from Acer, and this walked me right through the upgrade.   I never lost my internet connection, or my desktop settings, all my icons on the screen were as before, in fact everything looks identical until you start delving into the system menus. 

Now as others have said there's no email program with windows 7, and as I used outlook express previously I had to install Windows live mail to replace it.   All I had to do is let it transfer my email settings and emails etc for me before I did the Windows 7 upgrade.  I had no other programs to install because they were automatically imported into windows 7.

I had no loss of data, no loss of emails / browser settings or favourites, and no loss of programs.  The only problem I had with Vista previous to this was my IE8 browser used to crash constantly, and this has never happened since upgrading.

I'm well chuffed with just how smooth this PC runs now.  :tup:
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on March 28, 2010, 10:30:29 AM
I bought a laptop at the end of October

I'm a later convert to W7 having only upgraded a few days ago from XP which in itself isn't/wasn't bad. However, the more I get used to W7 the more I am beginning to like it. And on a laptop I'd say it's a must as it's supposed to be less greedy when it comes to battery consumption.
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: stevebedder on March 28, 2010, 11:04:33 AM
I've done 3 or 4 installs of Win7 and each time done it from scratch as I'm not a fan of upgrading an OS - I'd much rather have a clean build. Each time I've installed Win7 it's gone very quickly and without any problems.

The change from Vista to Win7 IMO is night and day, Win7 is so much slicker at what it does and the engine and gearbox has had a real good overhaul so that it makes much better use of your hardware. If you're running Vista now, you won't regret going to Win7 IMO.

Cheers

Steve
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: Forseti on April 22, 2010, 02:18:42 PM
'God Mode' for W7 - some might find this convenient. http://news.cnet.com/8301-13860_3-10423985-56.html
Title: Re: Windows 7
Post by: picsfor on April 22, 2010, 02:33:03 PM
bit like the old MMS folder in 2000 & XP.

It was created for the tech support people who would be able to configure whole networks and support tools to be dealt with from a single folder.
Great stuff, thanks for pointing it out, before i set about removing MS from my computing environment.