Camera Craniums: The Photography Community for Enthusiasts

General Category => Photo Feedback - Constructive Critique => Topic started by: DigiDiva on July 23, 2016, 03:56:46 PM

Title: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 23, 2016, 03:56:46 PM
I would love to hear your critique on this image. It's rare I post here for critique but I have bit the bullet. ....
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: Beaux Reflets on July 23, 2016, 04:24:50 PM
Very nice tones and atmospheric Chris.

I personally feel that there is too much foreground. Rule of thirds is a useful weapon and I would crop off the bottom so the (first stronger) highlight is closer to the bottom third area. -  Or keep size as is, and give, clone something into the fore, again around the bottom third region, perhaps more to the left to help balance the overall composition.

Either way the  viewer's eye will be invited to look again all around the image  :tup: 
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 23, 2016, 04:30:49 PM
Thanks Beaux
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: Oldboy on July 23, 2016, 06:04:20 PM
I like the foreground except the dark rocks/sand and shadow.I would have moved more left to include the sun's reflection. The pink sky works well with the slow shutter speed. Well spotted.  :tup:
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: Reinardina on July 23, 2016, 08:56:24 PM
I'm no good at critique, as I hardly ever see how an image could be improved, unless it is very obvious. And if it is very obvious, you never know, if the photographer did not do it on purpose. In this case however, I agree with Andy; I think the picture would have more impact, if cropped.

And, I'm glad you finally start using the site for more than the competitions! Welcome to CC.
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: StephenBatey on July 23, 2016, 09:24:46 PM
My own thoughts are centred on two points. The first to strike me was the position of the moon (or sun - I'll stick to moon), and the second the empty foreground.

My eye naturally follows the dark line in the waves/shoreline up to the moon's reflection and then "bounces" up to view the moon. This journey is broken at the outset by the dark line not running down to the bottom of the frame; and the upward journey of my eye is interrupted by the spit of rocks that jut in about a third of the way up.

If I'd taken this, I would have included more sky and less foreground, cutting it off such that the rocks occupy the bottom right hand corner. At the top of the frame, I would have included about as much extra sky as needed to more of less put the moon half way between the top of the frame and the top of the lighthouse. The moon then falls on the line joining the top right hand corner of the frame to the top of the lighthouse.

I checked out my ideas by moving the image to the bottom of my screen to effect a crop, and by opening a second window with the photo in and squeezing it down to just have the right amount of sky, and then arranged the windows to make it look joined.

I'm uncertain as to whether the "bump" - whatever it is - on the pier and near the left hand edge shouldn't be right on the edge. The pier needs it to act as a visual stop to the eye running out, but I think it would be improved by reducing the continuation of the pier beyond it to a minimum.

The area of sea just under the lighthouse/pier and extending to the left edge looks a little bare and featureless. I checked with the eyedropper in Photoshop and it's not (apparently) burned out, but it does distract. I tested my hypothesis of it being distracting by crudely cloning in some see from lower down, and found the result more satisfying. Interestingly (to me) it makes the image uncropped appear much stronger and much less in need of any cropping or extra sky.

And finally, I'd be tempted to darken the reflections that would fall in the bottom right corner after my suggested crop as being just a little too distracting as they are.

But if I'd taken it, it would be my picture, and I assume that we don't see things the same way.
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 23, 2016, 09:36:22 PM
Thanks Reinardina
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: ABERS on July 24, 2016, 08:59:34 AM
Can't  see a lot wrong with the image , however I agree the with  suggestions that a crop would enhance it.

I see it as a square image with the bottom part of the picture taken off to make it so. This would concentrate the eyes on all the important elements within the picture, ie the pier, lighthouse  and the moon and it's reflection.

That's  my tuppencewoth.
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 10:13:30 AM
Thanks old boy Stephen and Abers. I will go play and post the results. I'm pleased I asked especially as you all agree.
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: StephenBatey on July 24, 2016, 11:28:15 AM
Quote from: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 10:13:30 AM
I'm pleased I asked especially as you all agree.


On reflection, I will add a slightly dissenting voice. The crops as suggested (and we did all agree on that in principle at least) do seem to be the best way forward as it stands. But in the cold light of day, and revisiting my version with the cloned-in sea which retains the original otherwise intact, I prefer it to a cropped image. The long, thin shape of the image echoes the lighthouse, and leads the eye upwards to the heavens; the lighthouse could then be viewed as a gnomen (pointer on a sundial, or more generally a pointer).

Regardless of interpretation you could try this; or, if you wish, I'll post my rough correction which is still open (unsaved) in Photoshop.
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 11:52:10 AM
OK, here's the cloned version

Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 11:55:39 AM
And heres the square crop
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 11:58:38 AM
I think the cloned version looks odd because the land suddenly ends....do you guys think it looks a bit un-natural? Maybe I need to clone it differently

The square crop gives more impact to the main subject, which I really love (hence me putting it up for critique) but I think it takes away a bit of the loneliness, solitude and moodiness

Im really not sure....

Further comments would be appreciated

As a side comment, I have sold a copy of the original, got the order yesterday. Its for someones lovely new build town house as a show piece in their dinning room or bedroom (they can't decide). The house won't be done until December though. I might show them the clones and cropped versions to see what they think with their non-photography trained eyes!
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: StephenBatey on July 24, 2016, 12:07:26 PM
My cloned version looks different to yours:
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 01:02:48 PM
My eyes are getting on a bit but i can't see a difference between my original and your cloned.....its like a 'spot the difference' puzzle lol. Can you point it out?
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 02:34:51 PM
I also want to say that the thing I most thought you guys would pick up but didn't.......which again I am VERY pleased about, is that the moon is fake. It wasn't there..........it's taken from an image I took in Mallorca on April. I had to give the moon a reflection using cloning and dodge/burn.
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: StephenBatey on July 24, 2016, 05:06:22 PM
Certainly.

And if the moon is a fake - would you care to try placing it on the diagonal line from the corner top right to the top of the lighthouse?
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: Beaux Reflets on July 24, 2016, 06:20:57 PM
Quote from: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 02:34:51 PM
I also want to say that the thing I most thought you guys would pick up but didn't.......which again I am VERY pleased about, is that the moon is fake. It wasn't there..........it's taken from an image I took in Mallorca on April. I had to give the moon a reflection using cloning and dodge/burn.

To be honest, with your first upload I thought the surreal colour combination and patterns of light looked a little contrived and at first glance it did not occur to me to view the image with any closer look at all the finer detailing; Assuming that you were just seeking a general critique upon composition and layout having created a Surreal image (which is why I suggested cloning in something to balance the picture if you were not cropping it).

I would be the last one to tell an artist how they should have painted a particular picture, unless they specifically asked upon specific aspects in detailing.
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: Reinardina on July 24, 2016, 08:55:02 PM
The colours are real, maybe a bit saturated.

I noticed last Monday, that te moon was quite high, in a very beautifully coloured evening sky. The colours are not that unusual, but this was the Southern sky, rather that the Wstern one.

(http://cameracraniums.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11140/normal_Sky_5532_Moon_res.jpg) (http://cameracraniums.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=19366&fullsize=1)
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: Oldboy on July 24, 2016, 09:19:17 PM
I remember going out one morning, a few years ago, to take pictures of the sunrise when the whole sky changed to a bright pink. I couldn't believe it. Normally, any colour change fades as the distance from the light source increases but, in this case it didn't.  :o
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 09:47:58 PM
Glad my image had created something to talk about. Thats what it's all about. The colours were tweaked by adding a filter and adjusting hue/saturation but not a great deal. It was the filter that gave the surreal effect I was after. I cloned out the rock in the foreground and added the moon. Here they are, side by side, original (left) post processing (right).
Title: Re: Roker Pier, Sunderland
Post by: DigiDiva on July 24, 2016, 09:53:42 PM
Reinardina, heres one similar to yours, that I took in my very early camera days. The colours are stunning